You know, we're going to do things a little differently. I'm not going to show you a presentation. I'm going to talk to you. And at the same time, we're going to look at just images from a photo stream that is pretty close to live of things that -- snapshots from Second Life. So hopefully this will be fascinating. You can -- I can compete for your attention with the strange pictures that you see on screen that come from there. I thought I'd talk a little bit about some just big ideas about this, and then get John back out here so we can talk interactively a little bit more and think and ask questions. You know, I guess the first question is, why build a virtual world at all? And I think the answer to that is always going to be at least driven to a certain extent by the people initially crazy enough to start the project, you know.
我想,今天和往常來點不一樣的 我不打算做個很正式的簡報,而是透過聊天的方式..... 同時我們會單純地看到很多圖片 這些圖片都是「第二人生(Second Life)」的真實場景 希望你們會喜歡 我會持續用這些顯示在那邊螢幕上其怪的圖片來 吸引你們的注意力 我想,就先從大架構開始談起 然後請John 回到台上,這樣我們可以較為互動的方式討論 多一點的思考及發問 首先,第一個問題是 為什麼要創造一個虛擬的世界? 這問題的答案....你可以說是 我應該是瘋了吧 才會有這個異想天開的構想
So I can give you a little bit of first background just on me and what moved me as a -- really going back as far as a teenager and then an adult, to actually try and build this kind of thing. I was a very creative kid who read a lot, and got into electronics first, and then later, programming computers, when I was really young. I was just always trying to make things. I was just obsessed with taking things apart and building things, and just anything I could do with my hands or with wood or electronics or metal or anything else. And so, for example -- and it's a great Second Life thing -- I had a bedroom. And every kid, you know, as a teenager, has got his bedroom he retreats to -- but I wanted my door, I thought it would be cool if my door went up rather than opened, like on Star Trek. I thought it would be neat to do that. And so I got up in the ceiling and I cut through the ceiling joists, much to my parents' delight, and put the door, you know, being pulled up through the ceiling.
這得回溯到我的成長背景 及驅使我的動力。這一切得從我青少年時代說起 然後到我成年的時候,才去真正的建構這些東西 我小時候相當富有創意,也讀很多書。從電子產品開始切入 當我很年輕的時候,接著踏入電腦程式設計 從很小時,我就愛嘗試自己動手做東西 尤其沉迷在把東西開解後再進行組裝 只要任何手工或可以完成的 不管是木工,電子或金屬類的東西,我都愛 舉例來說,我的臥室,像是第二人生一樣 所有小孩在青少年時代都有自己的房間,一個可以避難的地方 但我想要一個可以往上開啟而不是單純旋轉開啟的門 像"星際爭霸戰"一樣,那有多酷! 我覺得這點子太棒了,所以我爬到天花板 鑿開支撐用的托梁(我爸媽應該快瘋了吧!) 把門從天花板往上拉
I built -- I put a garage-door opener up in the attic that would pull this door up. You can imagine the amount of time that it took me to do this to the house and the displeasure of my parents. The thing that was always striking to me was that we as people could have so many really amazing ideas about things we'd like to do, but are so often unable, in the real world, to actually do those things -- to actually cobble together the materials and go through the actual execution phase of building something that you imagine from a design perspective. And so for me, I know that when the Internet came around and I was doing computer programming and just, you know, just generally trying to run my own little company and figure out what to do with the Internet and with computers, I was just immediately struck by how the ultimate thing that you would really want to do with the Internet and with computers would be to use the Internet and connected computers to simulate a world to sort of recreate the laws of physics and the rules of how things went together -- the sort of -- the idea of atoms and how to make things, and do that inside a computer so that we could all get in there and make stuff.
我也改了車庫的門 它可以穿過閣樓向上開啟 不難想像我花了多少時間做這些改造 和使我父母不高興 最令我不解的是,身為一個人 明明有很多我們喜歡做的事的點子 然而在現實生活中,實際能做到事卻少又少 既不能湊齊所需材料 更遑論將腦海中的設計藍圖 變成具體執行的步驟 至於我,隨著網路逐漸普及 除了從事電腦程式設計的工作外 也想著如何利用網路及電腦 著手自行創業 突然有天靈光一閃 我最想在網路及電腦上做的事情 就是透過網路及電腦 去模擬創造一個虛擬世界, 這個世界不但有新的物理法則 也改變了萬事萬物的定律 就像是原子可以重組成新分子的概念 利用電腦建構這樣一個虛擬世界的想法
And so for me that was the thing that was so enticing. I just wanted this place where you could build things. And so I think you see that in the genesis of what has happened with Second Life, and I think it's important. I also think that more generally, the use of the Internet and technology as a kind of a space between us for creativity and design is a general trend. It is a -- sort of a great human progress. Technology is just generally being used to allow us to create in as shared and social a way as possible. And I think that Second Life and virtual worlds more generally represent the best we can do to achieve that right now. You know, another way to look at that, and related to the content and, you know, thinking about space, is to connect sort of virtual worlds to space. I thought that might be a fun thing to talk about for a second. If you think about going into space, it's a fascinating thing. So many movies, so many kids, we all sort of dream about exploring space. Now, why is that? Stop for a moment and ask, why that conceit? Why do we as people want to do that? I think there's a couple of things. It's what we see in the movies -- you know, it's this dream that we all share.
對我來說實在太誘人了 我只是想要一個地方能讓我自由創造 我相信現在你們了解了 "第二人生"的源起,這非常重要 普遍來說,網路科技的應用已提供一個 嶄新的創造及設計發展的平台 這是人類發展的一大突破 科技的應用使我們能夠建立 一個交流分享和社交的方式 而我相信,"第二人生"或其他虛擬世界 可說是目前網路科技應用的極致 換個角度來看 好比外太空 如果將虛擬的世界和宇宙空間結合 這很有趣,我想多談一些 試想如果你能進入外太空,那有多酷! 很多電影情節,很多小孩 多多少少都夢想過,這是為什麼呢? 停下來想想看, 為什麼人這麼想呢? 為什麼人類會想進入外太空呢? 原因很多, 正如我們在電影中看到的 進入外太空幾乎是人類共同的夢想
One is that if you went into space you'd be able to begin again. In some sense, you would become someone else in that journey, because there wouldn't be -- you'd leave society and life as you know it, behind. And so inevitably, you would transform yourself -- irreversibly, in all likelihood -- as you began this exploration. And then the second thing is that there's this tangible sense that if you travel far enough, you can find out there -- oh, yeah -- you have no idea what you're going to find once you get there, into space. It's going to be different than here. And in fact, it's going to be so different than what we see here on earth that anything is going to be possible. So that's kind of the idea -- we as humans crave the idea of creating a new identity and going into a place where anything is possible. And I think that if you really sit and think about it, virtual worlds, and where we're going with more and more computing technology, represent essentially the likely, really tactically possible version of space exploration. We are moved by the idea of virtual worlds because, like space, they allow us to reinvent ourselves and they contain anything and everything, and probably anything could happen there.
原因之一是當你進到太空中人生有了重新開始的機會 在某些面向來看,你在那個旅途中變成另外一個人 離開你所熟悉的環境 你的一切無可避免地都將改變 當你進入這個探索後你將無可避免的,無可復原的徹底改變 第二個原因是那種身歷其境的感覺 如果你走得夠遠,你會發現 你不知道你下一步會遇到什麼 一旦進入外太空 所有事情和這裡都不一樣 和我們所熟悉的地球完全不同 在這裡凡事都有可能 就是這種感覺,人們發展這一個概念 擁有有新的身份,進入新的地方,創造新的可能 我相信如果你真的坐下來認真思考 這虛擬世界 有著更多的電腦科技 實際上就像是 更真實的太空歷險 虛擬世界就像外太空一樣 可以重新改變自己 讓任何事都變得可能
You know, to give you a size idea about scale, you know, comparing space to Second Life, most people don't realize, kind of -- and then this is just like the Internet in the early '90s. In fact, Second Life virtual worlds are a lot like the Internet in the early '90s today: everybody's very excited, there's a lot of hype and excitement about one idea or the next from moment to moment, and then there's despair and everybody thinks the whole thing's not going to work. Everything that's happening with Second Life and more broadly with virtual worlds, all happened in the early '90s. We always play a game at the office where you can take any article and find the same article where you just replace the words "Second Life" with "Web," and "virtual reality" with "Internet." You can find exactly the same articles written about everything that people are observing. To give you an idea of scale, Second Life is about 20,000 CPUs at this point. It's about 20,000 computers connected together in three facilities in the United States right now, that are simulating this virtual space. And the virtual space itself -- there's about 250,000 people a day that are wandering around in there, so the kind of, active population is something like a smallish city. The space itself is about 10 times the size of San Francisco, and it's about as densely built out.
說到規模 若拿外太空和第二人生相比,很多人不了解 這就好比90年代初期的網路 事實上,第二人生就像當時的網路一樣 讓人興奮不已 任何新的概念都容易引起話題 但一段時間過後,失望感油然而生 並且大家會認為所有的事情都不可行 第二人生經歷過的所有事情 其他虛擬世界經歷過的,都和90年代網路萌芽時一樣 我們都玩過一種遊戲,隨便找一篇文章 把裡頭"網站"替換成"第二人生" 把"網路"替換成"虛擬實境" 結果發現 原先文章想表達的內容並不因此有所改變 再談到規模,"第二人生"目前由2萬個CPU來運作 意思是由2萬台電腦 透過三個中心相互連接 來模擬這個虛擬世界和自己的虛擬空間 在這裡每天平圴有25萬人駐足 上線人數相當於一個小型城市的人口規模 而這虛擬空間大約是舊金山的10倍大 而且用同樣的密度建造的
So it gives you an idea of scale. Now, it's expanding very rapidly -- about five percent a month or so right now, in terms of new servers being added. And so of course, radically unlike the real world, and like the Internet, the whole thing is expanding very, very quickly, and historically exponentially. So that sort of space exploration thing is matched up here by the amount of content that's in there, and I think that amount is critical. It was critical with the virtual world that it be this space of truly infinite possibility. We're very sensitive to that as humans. You know, you know when you see it. You know when you can do anything in a space and you know when you can't. Second Life today is this 20,000 machines, and it's about 100 million or so user-created objects where, you know, an object would be something like this, possibly interactive. Tens of millions of them are thinking all the time; they have code attached to them. So it's a really large world already, in terms of the amount of stuff that's there and that's very important. If anybody plays, like, World of Warcraft, World of Warcraft comes on, like, four DVDs. Second Life, by comparison, has about 100 terabytes of user-created data, making it about 25,000 times larger.
現在你可以想像它的規模,但同時它拓展的速度也很快 伺服器大約以每個月5%的速率持續擴充 當然, 這在實體世界無法想像 網路正以迅雷不及掩耳 一日千里的速度飛快成長 但要維持爆炸性成長的動能 取決於包羅萬象,多采多姿的內容 我覺得內容是關鍵 它是創造無限可能的關鍵 這在虛擬世界尤其如此 人其實很敏感的 初次接觸的剎那 就知道結果了 今天的第二人生雖然僅是這2萬台機器 它卻包含了1億個,由使用者開發出來的創意 這些創意可能像是這樣 同時可能有數仟萬人在想同樣的事 而僅僅以簡單的帳號及密碼,就能連結所有的人 虛擬世界的規模之大超乎你的想像 帶來的影響絕不可小覷 拿"魔獸世界"來說 約4片DVD的大小 而第二人生,則約有100TB由使用者建立資料的容量 整整比魔獸世界大了25,000倍
So again, like the Internet compared to AOL, and the sort of chat rooms and content on AOL at the time, what's happening here is something very different, because the sheer scale of what people can do when they're enabled to do anything they want is pretty amazing. The last big thought is that it is almost certainly true that whatever this is going to evolve into is going to be bigger in total usage than the Web itself. And let me justify that with two statements. Generically, what we use the Web for is to organize, exchange, create and consume information. It's kind of like Irene talking about Google being data-driven. I'd say I kind of think about the world as being information. Everything that we interact with, all the experiences that we have, is kind of us flowing through a sea of information and interacting with it in different ways. The Web puts information in the form of text and images. The topology, the geography of the Web is text-to-text links for the most part. That's one way of organizing information, but there are two things about the way you access information in a virtual world that I think are the important ways that they're very different and much better than what we've been able to do to date with the Web.
同樣地,拿網路和"美國線上"來說 在當時"美國線上"的聊天室或其他內容 和第二人生是很不一樣的 因為現在人們可以做的事情 種類之繁多令人眼花撩亂 最後一個想法,也可以說是事實 無論第二人生未來走向為何 虛擬世界的功能要比網路本身重要得多 我可以證明這兩個論點 一般而言,我們使用網路是為了組織,交換 創造及消化各類資訊 這好比Irene剛談到的,我們使用Google 來搜尋資訊 試著想像這世界係由訊息組成 我們所交流, 所經歷的每件事 就像是遊蕩在資訊大海中 只是用不同的方式進行互動 網路用內容和影像呈現它要表達的訊息 網路的拓樸結構,地理結構是構成文對文連接最重要的部份 這也是組織資訊的一種方式 但在虛擬世界裡有另外二種方式 這也顯示為何虛擬世界是如此不同 且遠比和網路互動來得重要的原因
The first is that, as I said, the -- well, the first difference for virtual worlds is that information is presented to you in the virtual world using the most powerful iconic symbols that you can possibly use with human beings. So for example, C-H-A-I-R is the English word for that, but a picture of this is a universal symbol. Everybody knows what it means. There's no need to translate it. It's also more memorable if I show you that picture, and I show you C-H-A-I-R on a piece of paper. You can do tests that show that you'll remember that I was talking about a chair a couple of days later a lot better. So when you organize information using the symbols of our memory, using the most common symbols that we've been immersed in all our lives, you maximally both excite, stimulate, are able to remember, transfer and manipulate data. And so virtual worlds are the best way for us to essentially organize and experience information.
第一個原因,如我之前提過的 虛擬世界的第一個不同 是它利用具強烈代表性的符號 具體呈現要表達的訊息 這在實體世界很難做到 比方說,椅子的英文拼音是CHAIR 而這圖案是全球通用的符號 所有人一看就知道,不需要任何的解釋 我先給你看圖案 和一張寫上"椅子"的紙 這已經使你印象深刻,你再試試看 幾天之後當我們再談起"椅子", 你會記得更牢 所以利用符號,利用記憶中的符號 利用這些充斥於生活中,隨處可見的符號 能使得記憶,傳輸和處理數據 發揮和激盪出最大效益 因此虛擬的網路環境絶對是 幫助我們處理和體驗訊息最好的方法
And I think that's something that people have talked about for 20 years -- you know, that 3D, that lifelike environments are really important in some magical way to us. But the second thing -- and I think this one is less obvious -- is that the experience of creating, consuming, exploring that information is in the virtual world implicitly and inherently social. You are always there with other people. And we as humans are social creatures and must, or are aided by, or enjoy more, the consumption of information in the presence of others. It's essential to us. You can't escape it. When you're on Amazon.com and you're looking for digital cameras or whatever, you're on there right now, when you're on the site, with like 5,000 other people, but you can't talk to them. You can't just turn to the people that are browsing digital cameras on the same page as you, and ask them, "Hey, have you seen one of these before? Because I'm thinking about buying it."
雖然3D影像技術已經被談論將近20年了 但它所帶來的逼真虛擬實境 至今依然令人驚奇 第二個原因,可能沒那麼明顯 我們在創造,消化以及探索資訊的過程中 虛擬世界所隱含固有的社群經驗 不論何時何地,一定有人和你同時上線 人類是群居動物,必須要經由協助 我們需要與別人分享,互動來處理資訊 這很重要,你不能逃脫這個模式 當你上"亞馬遜"網站試著找一台數位相機 你可能發現同時有5000人在線上,也在這網站上 但你無法和他們交談 你無法和這群和你同樣在瀏覽著數位相機的人 並且問他們 "你有看過這款嗎?我想買耶!"
That experience of like, shopping together, just as a simple example, is an example of how as social creatures we want to experience information in that way. So that second point, that we inherently experience information together or want to experience it together, is critical to essentially, kind of, this trend of where we're going to use technology to connect us. And so I think, again, that it's likely that in the next decade or so these virtual worlds are going to be the most common way as human beings that we kind of use the electronics of the Internet, if you will, to be together, to consume information. You know, mapping in India -- that's such a great example. Maybe the solution there involves talking to other people in real time. Asking for advice, rather than any possible way that you could just statically organize a map.
這種互動的經驗,簡單來說,像是一起逛街 是一種人與人間的交流 我們需要與人分享 所以第二點是, 我們與生俱來就和別人一起體驗資訊 或者想要一起體驗 基本上來說很難, 有點像是 我們要用這個科技把我們聯繫在一起的趨勢 而我想, 此外, 應該在下個十年左右 這些虛擬世界將會變成最頻繁的方式 就像是我們使用網路,你們也會 肩並肩,一起處理資訊 舉一個極為貼切的例子:為印度畫地圖 解決問題的辦法可能包含和現實世界的人交談 詢問相關建議,而非給予 技巧性的組織一個地圖的所有可能的方法
So I think that's another big point. I think that wherever this is all going, whether it's Second Life or its descendants, or something broader that happens all around the world at a lot of different points -- this is what we're going to see the Internet used for, and total traffic and total unique users is going to invert, so that the Web and its bibliographic set of text and graphical information is going to become a tool or a part of that consumption pattern, but the pattern itself is going to happen mostly in this type of an environment. Big idea, but I think highly defensible. So let me stop there and bring John back, and maybe we can just have a longer conversation. Thank you. John. That's great.
我認為這又是另外一個重點 我想不管這些事情怎麼去發展 不管是「第二人生」或其更寬更廣的衍生 都在全世界各個角落有著不同面向的發展 這正是我們要看網路使用的目的 和所有流量及各個獨一無二的使用者 因此網路中每組書目的文字及圖像的資訊 將會成為處理資訊的一部分或一個工具 但這種模式大部分會發生在網路這種環境裡 這一個好的想法, 就讓我停在這然後把約翰帶回來 或許我們可以有一個更長的談話 謝謝。約翰,這樣很棒。
(Applause)
(掌聲)
John Hockenberry: Why is the creation, the impulse to create Second Life, not a utopian impulse? Like for example, in the 19th century, any number of works of literature that imagined alternative worlds were explicitly utopian.
約翰●哈根培力(以下簡稱JH):為什麼是創造力創造了"第二人生" 而非烏托邦?? 舉一個例子來說,在19世紀 為數可觀的文學作品想像另一個替代的世界 單純都是烏托邦
Philip Rosedale: I think that's great. That's such a deep question. Yeah. Is a virtual world likely to be a utopia, would be one way I'd say it. The answer is no, and I think the reason why is because the Web itself as a good example is profoundly bottoms-up. That idea of infinite possibility, that magic of anything can happen, only happens in an environment where you really know that there's a fundamental freedom at the level of the individual actor, at the level of the Lego blocks, if you will, that make up the virtual world. You have to have that level of freedom, and so I'm often asked that, you know, is there a, kind of, utopian or, is there a utopian tendency to Second Life and things like it, that you would create a world that has a grand scheme to it? Those top-down schemes are alienating to just about everybody, even if you mean well when you build them. And what's more, human society, when it's controlled, when you set out a grand scheme of rules, a new way of people interacting, or a new way of laying out a city, or whatever, that stuff historically has never scaled much beyond, you know -- I always laughingly say -- the Mall of America, you know, which is like, the largest piece of centrally designed architecture that, you know, has been built.
菲利浦●羅斯德(以下簡稱PR):我認為這是一個很棒很深的問題 虛擬世界難道都像烏托邦一樣嗎? 答案是否定的。原因在於 網路自己本身就是一個很深刻的例子 甚麼事情都有可能發生這一個無窮的機會 只會在一個環境下發生 一個發自於底層自由的環境 在每一個獨立個體,在每一層樂高積木下 虛擬世界也因而建立 我常常要求說,你必須要擁有這些程度的自由 你想知道,是否存在類似烏托邦 或是有類似於烏托邦趨勢 並且在一個龐大的架構下建立的「第二人生」 這些由上而下的框架會漸漸地違背大家 即使你當初立意良善的建造 另外,在一個受到控制下的人類社會 當你設立出一系列規則 新的人與人之間的互動方式,或是一個新的都市規劃等 這些東西在過育歷史上從未被料到 我常常笑著說,"The Mall of America" 就像是一大件經由統一設計規劃 已經建造完成的建築物
JH: The Kremlin was pretty big.
JH:克林姆林宮很大
PR: The Kremlin, yeah. That's true. The whole complex.
PR:沒錯,整體上很大
JH: Give me a story of a tool you created at the beginning in Second Life that you were pretty sure people would want to use in the creation of their avatars or in communicating that people actually in practice said, no, I'm not interested in that at all, and name something that you didn't come up with that almost immediately people began to demand.
JH:告訴我你當初是怎麼做出來的 在第二人生裡面你很篤定人們喜歡使用 當人們要製造呈現在虛擬世界的自己或是利用在溝通上面 但結果經由一些人使用後又完全對這些東西沒興趣 同時列出一些你當初沒有想到 但又有許多人很需要的東西
PR: I'm sure I can think of multiple examples of both of those. One of my favorites. I had this feature that I built into Second Life -- I was really passionate about it. It was an ability to kind of walk up close to somebody and have a more private conversation, but it wasn't instant messaging because you had to sort of befriend somebody. It was just this idea that you could kind of have a private chat. I just remember it was one of those examples of data-driven design. I thought it was such a good idea from my perspective, and it was just absolutely never used, and we ultimately -- I think we've now turned it off, if I remember. We finally gave up, took it out of the code. But more generally, you know, one other example I think about this, which is great relative to the utopian idea. Second Life originally had 16 simulators. It now has 20,000.
PR:我相信我可以找到許多關於這兩個問題的例子 舉一個在第二人生我做的東西當中我最喜歡的東西當例子 我對這樣東西充滿熱情 這個東西讓我們可以走向前靠近任何一個人 藉此可以擁有一個更私密的對談 但這又不像是即時通訊,因為你必須要先向對方示好 這就像進行一個私人的談話 那是一個資料驅動的設計 我想像這會是一個極為棒的想法 但他從未被實際運用 現在整個功能已被停用 我們終於放棄它,把它從原始碼中抽了出來 另外一個廣泛的例子 一個有輒烏托邦概念的點子 第二人生原本只有16組模擬器。現在他擴到了兩萬組
So when it only had 16, it was only about as big as this college campus. And we had -- we zoned it, you know: we put a nightclub, we put a disco where you could dance, and then we had a place where you could fight with guns if you wanted to, and we had another place that was like a boardwalk, kind of a Coney Island. And we laid out the zoning, but of course, people could build all around it however they wanted to. And what was so amazing right from the start was that the idea that we had put out in the zoning concept, basically, was instantly and thoroughly ignored, and like, two months into the whole thing, -- which is really a small amount of time, even in Second Life time -- I remember the users, the people who were then using Second Life, the residents came to me and said, we want to buy the disco -- because I had built it -- we want to buy that land and raze it and put houses on it. And I sold it to them -- I mean, we transferred ownership and they had a big party and blew up the entire building. And I remember that that was just so telling, you know, that you didn't know exactly what was going to happen. When you think about stuff that people have built that's popular --
在只有16組模擬器的時代裡 它的規模就像這座大學校園 我們還規劃了夜店 並且放了讓大家可以跳舞的迪斯可 另外還有一個可以讓你和別人拿槍單挑的地方 還有另一個地方有著又長又寬的走道,有點像是康尼島 我們針對每一區大致上作了規劃,當然 人們也可以隨心所欲的在任何地方大興土木 令人驚訝的是這些想法 分區規劃的想法一剛開始 是全盤的被忽略的 最後我們用了兩個月的時間一手打造這個分區的概念 說實在的兩個月的時間不是很長,就像是第二人生的時間一樣 我記得第二人生的使用者 這位居民向我想買下迪斯可的意願 他們想要買下那塊土地然後在摧毀再建 然後蓋一些房子在那邊。 轉交產權給他們 然後他們在摧毀整棟建築物 我這麼舉例只想讓你知道 你永遠不能預期即將要發生的事情 當其他人建造一些很受歡迎建築物的時候
JH: CBGB's has to close eventually, you know. That's the rule.
JH:CBGB酒吧(被公認是龐克音樂的誕生地)最終還是不敵關門大吉的命運
PR: Exactly. And it -- but it closed on day one, basically, in Internet time. You know, an example of something -- pregnancy. You can have a baby in Second Life. This is done entirely using, kind of, the tools that are built into Second Life, so the innate concept of becoming pregnant and having a baby, of course -- Second Life is, at the platform level, at the level of the company -- at Linden Lab -- Second Life has no game properties to it whatsoever. There is no attempt to structure the experience, to make it utopian in that sense that we put into it. So of course, we never would have put a mechanism for having babies or, you know, taking two avatars and merging them, or something.
PR:沒錯!在網路時間上它只關門一天 來舉個例子:懷孕 你可以在第二人生裡面生小來 這些可以藉由第二人生裡面的一些工具 這些懷孕生子的概念 在公司層面的第二人生平台,在蘭登實驗室 第二人生裡面沒有遊戲成分在 我們完全沒有想要有整個生小孩過程的嘗試 因此我們轉向放一些烏托邦概念進去 也因如此,我們不可能有生小孩的過程 也就是讓兩個虛擬人結合或是其它的
But people built the ability to have babies and care for babies as a purchasable experience that you can have in Second Life and so -- I mean, that's a pretty fascinating example of, you know, what goes on in the overall economy. And of course, the existence of an economy is another idea. I didn't talk about it, but it's a critical feature. When people are given the opportunity to create in the world, there's really two things they want. One is fair ownership of the things they create. And then the second one is -- if they feel like it, and they're not going to do it in every case, but in many they are -- they want to actually be able to sell that creation as a way of providing for their own livelihood. True on the Web -- also true in Second Life. And so the existence of an economy is critical.
但是人們添加了擁有小嬰兒並照顧他的能力 當作一個付費的第二人生擴充功能 我覺得這是一個令人讚嘆的點子 整個消費上的制度和想法 當然經濟消費的另外一個想法 我在這裡不多做說明,因為他是一個棘手的制度 當人在這個世界上被賦予創造的能力 其中有兩樣事情他們想要 其中一個是對他們創造的東西有合理的所有權 另外一個是 雖然這可能不是一定會發生,但有時候 他們會想要隨時買賣創造出來的東西 作為一個維持他們生活的依據 不管事在網路或是第二人生這兩條準則都適用 也因此經濟活動的存在很關鍵
JH: Questions for Philip Rosedale? Right here.
JH:有觀眾要問菲利浦●羅斯德問題的嗎?那邊那位
(Audience: Well, first an observation, which is that you look like a character.)
觀眾:據我觀察,擬向其中一位虛擬人物
JH: The observation is, Philip has been accused of looking like a character, an avatar, in Second Life. Respond, and then we'll get the rest of your question.
JH:這位觀眾所做的觀察,菲利浦被說像是一個 在第二人生的虛擬人物 先讓飛利浦回答,等會再讓你問完問題
PR: But I don't look like my avatar.
PR:但我和我的西你人物完全不像阿
(Laughter)
(笑)
How many people here know what my avatar looks like? That's probably not very many.
在座各位有誰知道我的虛擬人物長怎樣? 可能大部分的人都不知道吧
JH: Are you ripping off somebody else's avatar with that, sort of -- PR: No, no. I didn't. One of the other guys at work had a fantastic avatar -- a female avatar -- that I used to be once in a while. But my avatar is a guy wearing chaps. Spiky hair -- spikier than this. Kind of orange hair. Handlebar mustache. Kind of a Village People sort of a character. So, very cool.
JH:你是不是會用別人的人物改造成自己的? PR:不我不會。但我同事做了一個很炫的人物 我曾經用了一段時間的女性人物 但我的人物是一位穿著長布褲的男生 比我現在頭髮還尖刺的橙色刺蝟頭 並留著絡腮鬍。像是一位村民 哇真酷
JH: And your question?
JH:你的問題是
(Audience: [Unclear].)
(聲音太小聽不見)
JH: The question is, there appears to be a lack of cultural fine-tuning in Second Life. It doesn't seem to have its own culture, and the sort of differences that exist in the real world aren't translated into the Second Life map.
JH:問題是這樣的,就是說第二人生好像少了點文化元素 他好像並沒有形成自己的文化 像是世界上的文化差異性 好像並沒有在第二人生裡面出現
PR: Well, first of all, we're very early, so this has only been going on for a few years. And so part of what we see is the same evolution of human behavior that you see in emerging societies. So a fair criticism -- is what it is -- of Second Life today is that it's more like the Wild West than it is like Rome, from a cultural standpoint. That said, the evolution of, and the nuanced interaction that creates culture, is happening at 10 times the speed of the real world, and in an environment where, if you walk into a bar in Second Life, 65 percent of the people there are not in the United States, and in fact are speaking their, you know, various and different languages. In fact, one of the ways to make money in Second Life is to make really cool translators that you drag onto your body and they basically, kind of, pop up on your screen and allow you to use Google or Babel Fish or one of the other online text translators to on-the-fly translate spoken -- I'm sorry -- typed text between individuals. And so, the multicultural nature and the sort of cultural melting pot that's happening inside Second Life is quite -- I think, quite remarkable relative to what in real human terms in the real world we've ever been able to achieve. So, I think that culture will fine-tune, it will emerge, but we still have some years to wait while that happens, as you would naturally expect.
PR:首先 第二人生的成立只有短短幾年 所以我們看到的這些部分有點類似於在這社會中出現的 人類行為的演化 對於第二人生比較合理的說法我想 他在文化的角度來說比較像是西部大拓荒而非羅馬 文化之間細微的演變 正在以相較於現實世界10倍的速度進化著的 一個環境。當你走進一家酒吧 有6成5的人不是住在美國 事實上他們也說著各種不同的語言 在第二人生裡面賺錢的一個方法是 做出一個可以嵌入每一個虛擬人物的體中翻譯工具 基本上這工具會這麼運作:一個彈跳的視窗出現 讓你可以使用GOOGLE或是Babelfish(一個翻譯系統) 或是像那種線上翻譯系統的逐字翻譯 翻譯口語對談。抱歉,應該說是兩個人的文字對談 文化大熔爐的多元文化現象 正在第二人生進行著 這和現實生活世界有著 我們達成非凡的成就一樣 所以我認為文化的問題終究會出現 但我們還需要幾年的時間 自然的等待文化發展
JH: Other questions? Right here.
JH:還有任何問題嗎?那邊
(Audience: What's your demographic?)
觀眾:想詢問第二人生裡的人口資料
JH: What's your demographic? PR: So, the question is, what's the demographic. So, the average age of a person in Second Life is 32, however, the use of Second Life increases dramatically as your physical age increases. So as you go from age 30 to age 60 -- and there are many people in their sixties using Second Life -- this is also not a sharp curve -- it's very, very distributed -- usage goes up in terms of, like, hours per week by 40 percent as you go from age 30 to age 60 in real life, so there's not -- many people make the mistake of believing that Second Life is some kind of an online game. Actually it's generally unappealing -- I'm just speaking broadly and critically -- it's not very appealing to people that play online video games, because the graphics are not yet equivalent to -- I mean, these are very nice pictures, but in general the graphics are not quite equivalent to the fine-tuned graphics that you see in a Grand Theft Auto 4. So average age: 32. I mentioned 65 percent of the users are not in the United States. The distribution amongst countries is extremely broad.
JH:第二人生裡的一些人口資料? PR:所以問題是有關於人口資料 在第二人生裡面平均年齡大約是32歲 但是,使用率會隨著 使用者生理的年齡增加而急遽增加。所當你從30歲到60歲 有許多60多歲的人在使用第二人生 會均勻的分布沒有任何顯著的峰值 當你從30歲長到60歲 使用率,也就是每週使用的時間會增加四成 沒有很多人有著第二人生是個線上遊戲的錯誤認知 有些線上遊戲很難讓人感到很有吸引力的 我是以很廣泛的角度去討論的 網路遊戲缺乏吸引力的原因在於 因為線上遊戲的繪圖並沒有辦法比擬 那些很精緻的畫質 舉例來說線上遊戲的畫質沒有像 畫面經過優化的俠盜獵車手這一款遊戲來得好 平均年齡32歲 百分之65的使用者不是來自於美國 而是廣泛分布在不同的國家
There's users from, you know, virtually every country in the world now in Second Life. The dominant ones are -- if you take the UK and Europe, together they make up about 55 percent of the usage base in Second Life. In terms of psychographic -- oh, men and women: men and women are almost equally matched in Second Life, so about 45 percent of the people online right now on Second Life are women. Women use Second Life, though, about 30 to 40 percent more, on an hours basis, than men do, meaning that more men sign up than women, and more women stay and use it than men. So that's another demographic fact. In terms of psychographic, you know, the people in Second Life are remarkably dissimilar relative to what you might think, when you go in and talk to them and meet them, and I would, you know, challenge you to just do this and find out. But it's not a bunch of programmers. It's not easy to describe as a demographic. If I had to just sort of paint a broad picture, I'd say, remember the people who were really getting into eBay in the first few years of eBay? Maybe a little bit like that: in other words, people who are early adopters. They tend to be creative. They tend to be entrepreneurial. A lot of them -- about 55,000 people so far -- are cash-flow positive: they're making money from what -- I mean, real-world money -- from what they're doing in Second Life, so it's a very build -- still a creative, building things, build-your-own-business type of an orientation. So, that's it.
使用者來自於可說是在第二人生理各個不同的國家 主要來自於英國和歐洲 那兩個地區加起來就超過5成5 從心理角度來觀察 舉性別比例來說。在第二人生裡面男女比例大概都差不多 也就是大約百分之45的女性正在使用第二人生 女性使用第二人生的時間 大概會比男性多了30-40% 意思是說男性的註冊人數較女性來的多 並且女性使用者教會留下來使用 這也是另一個 以心理度來看的人口資料。在第二人生裡面的人 和你想像中的會有很顯著的差異 當你進去並和他們面對面交談你就會得到這些資料 我很確定你這麼做就可以得到這些資料 但若不是一群程式設計者 要統計這些人口資料是很難的 如果要給一個較具體的概念,我會這麼說: 記不記得當人們當初碰觸到EBAY拍賣第一年的時候 就像這樣。換句話說,第一批使用者 他們很具有創造力,很具有企業的精神 目前約有5萬5千人有正的資金收入 他們正靠著他們在第二人生裡的活動 賺著真實世界的錢。擁有創造力, 建造出一個很新潮的建築物、經營自己的事業 就是這樣!
JH: You describe yourself, Philip, as someone who was really creative when you were young and, you know, liked to make things. I mean, it's not often that you hear somebody describe themselves as really creative. I suspect that's possibly a euphemism for C student who spent a lot of time in his room? Is it possible?
JH:試著形容一下很有創意 在年輕喜歡自己動手做東西時候的自己 我的問題是說,你很難聽到別人 形容自己很有創意 我懷疑那些形容自己很有創意的人很有可能分數都拿C 並且花很多時間在自己的房間裡。這有可能嗎?
(Laughter)
(笑)
PR: I was a -- there were times I was a C student. You know, it's funny. When I got to college -- I studied physics in college -- and I got really -- it was funny, because I was definitely a more antisocial kid. I read all the time. I was shy. I don't seem like it now, but I was very shy. Moved around a bunch -- had that experience too. So I did, kind of, I think, live in my own world, and obviously that helps, you know, engage your real interest in something.
PR:好玩的是我曾經也是個分數拿C的學生 當我唸到大學主修物理 然後,這很可笑我知道 我那時候有點叛逆。但我常常閱讀 我那時候身性害羞,雖然現在好像不是這麼一回事 也經歷過常常在搬家的時候 所以我可以說是活在自己的世界 當然這也幫助我探索自己真正喜愛的事物
JH: So you're on your fifth life at this point?
JH:哦,所以你現在正過著第五人生是吧?
PR: If you count, yeah, cities. So -- but I did -- and I didn't do -- I think I didn't do as well in school as I could have. I think you're right. I wasn't, like, an obsessed -- you know, get A's kind of guy. I was going to say, I had a great social experience when I went to college that I hadn't had before, a more fraternal experience, where I met six or seven other guys who I studied physics with, and I was very competitive with them, so then I started to get A's. But you're right: I wasn't an A student.
PR:哈,可能是吧 你剛說的沒錯,我不是很執著於分數的那種人 不是那種分數都拿A的人 但當我進大學讀書後 擁有有別以往不同的社交經驗 同時也認識的5.6位死黨 大家一起念物理,一起競爭 然後我的分數才拿A。但你沒錯,我不是為很好的學生
JH: Last question. Right here.
JH:最後一個問題。邊
(Audience: In the pamphlet, there's a statement -- )
觀眾:在小冊子裡面有一段陳述...
JH: You want to paraphrase that?
JH:菲利浦你在重新產觸一下這段好嗎?
PR: Yeah, so let me restate that. So, you're saying that in the pamphlet there's a statement that we may come to prefer our digital selves to our real ones -- our more malleable or manageable digital identities to our real identities -- and that in fact, much of human life and human experience may move into the digital realm. And then that's kind of a horrifying thought, of course. That's a frightening change, frightening disruption. I guess, and you're asking, what do I think about that? How do I --
PR:沒問題,我再重新說明一遍 所以你提到說在小冊子裡面的某一段敘述 就是我們可能比較傾向於數位的世界而非真實的世界 起因於數位身分相較於真實身分較彈性較易管理 同時在人類的世界有許多東西和經驗 將會被移轉到數位的世界 雖然這是一個很恐怖的事實 一個恐怖的改變及分裂 我想你是想問我對於這個改變的想法?我怎麼去
JH: What's your response to the people who would say, that's horrifying?
JH:你要怎麼回應這些認為這些改變很恐怖的人?
(Audience: If someone would say to you, I find that disturbing, what would be your response?)
觀眾:如果有人和你說,我覺得這個改變很煩 底的回答會和他一樣嗎?
PR: Well, I'd say a couple of things. One is, it's disturbing like the Internet or electricity was. That is to say, it's a big change, but it isn't avoidable. So, no amount of backpedaling or intentional behavior or political behavior is going to keep these technology changes from connecting us together, because the basic motive that people have -- to be creative and entrepreneurial -- is going to drive energy into these virtual worlds in the same way that it has with the Web. So this change, I believe, is a huge disruptive change.
PR:關於這個問題 第一,這惱人的程度就像網路和電力一樣 就是說,這是一個很劇烈無可避免的改變 所以沒有任何的政治力 來阻止或減緩這一系列用來連結我們 科技的改變 因為人個基本的動力: 創造力和企業家精神是用來 和網路一樣的驅使這一虛擬世界。 所以這些改變我相信是一個劇烈性的改變
Obviously, I'm the optimist and a big believer in what's going on here, but I think that as -- even a sober, you know, the most sober, disconnected thinker about this, looking at it from the side, has to conclude, based on the data, that with those kinds of economic forces at play, there is definitely going to be a sea change, and that change is going to be intensely disruptive relative to our concept of our very lives and being, and our identities, as well. I don't think we can get away from those changes. I think generally, we were talking about this -- I think that generally being present in a virtual world and being challenged by it, being -- surviving there, having a good life there, so to speak, is a challenge because of the multiculturality of it, because of the languages, because of the entrepreneurial richness of it, the sort of flea market nature, if you will, of the virtual world today.
很顯然地,我對於這些改驗抱持著一種樂觀的態度 但我認為身為一個旁觀者,大部分的旁觀者 和當事者分離,從旁觀的角度觀察 必須要藉由經濟的力量 的資料來做出結論 這些改變必然是個巨變 這些有關於我們的生活及行為模式的改變 將會是很劇烈地 同時也會影響到我們的身分 我不相信我們可以逃避這些改變 一般談論到這個 在虛擬世界中存在並且正在挑戰面對的改變 在虛擬世界裡面能夠存活,有一個好的生活 都是一個挑戰因為文化的多性 因為語言 因為一個類似於跳蚤市場的天性。如果可以,現今的虛擬世界
It puts challenges on us to rise to. We must be better than ourselves, in many ways. We must learn things and, you know, be more tolerant, and be smarter and learn faster and be more creative, perhaps, than we are typically in our real lives. And I think that if that is true of virtual worlds, then these changes, though scary -- and, I say, inevitable -- are ultimately for the better, and therefore something that we should ride out. But I would say that -- and many other authors and speakers about this, other than me, have said, you know, fasten your seat belts because the change is coming. There are going to be big changes. JH: Philip Rosedale, thank you very much.
在面對這麼多挑戰當中,我們必須要多面向的強化自己 我們必須回會包容 並且相較於典型的生活 要更聰明更具有創造力 我認為這些在虛擬世界中也是適用的 這些無可避免的改變雖恐怖 但終究是往好的方向走 一個可以安全度過的好方法 這我可能和其他講者一致 就是準備好一竊,繫好安全帶 因為重大的改變正要發生。將會有一系列的改變 JH:謝謝你菲利浦●羅斯德,
(Applause)
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