So I understand that this meeting was planned, and the slogan was From Was to Still. And I am illustrating Still. Which, of course, I am not agreeing with because, although I am 94, I am not still working. And anybody who asks me, "Are you still doing this or that?" I don't answer because I'm not doing things still, I'm doing it like I always did. I still have -- or did I use the word still? I didn't mean that.
我知道這場講座是活動的一部分 活動標語是「從『曾經』到『延續』」 而我是「延續」的長青代表 當然,我並不同意這個題目 雖然我已經94歲了,不表示我是「繼續」工作 如果有人問我「你還繼續工作嗎?」 我並不回答,因為我並不是「延續」我以前做的事,而是我就和以前的我一樣 我還繼續 -- 我剛剛是用了「繼續」這個詞嗎? 我不是這個意思
(Laughter)
(笑聲)
I have my file which is called To Do. I have my plans. I have my clients. I am doing my work like I always did. So this takes care of my age. I want to show you my work so you know what I am doing and why I am here. This was about 1925. All of these things were made during the last 75 years.
我有我待辦的任務,我有我的計畫 我有我的客戶。我一如往常地做這份工作。 這讓我能像以前一樣充滿活力 我將呈現我的作品,讓你們了解我的工作以及我到這裡分享的原因 這是發表於1925年 這些作品都是發表於...過去75年
(Laughter)
(笑聲)
(Applause)
(掌聲)
But, of course, I'm working since 25, doing more or less what you see here. This is Castleton China. This was an exhibition at the Museum of Modern Art. This is now for sale at the Metropolitan Museum. This is still at the Metropolitan Museum now for sale. This is a portrait of my daughter and myself.
不過當然,我從25歲就開始設計 所做的差不多如你們這裡所見到的。這是卡斯爾頓瓷器 它曾經是現代藝術博物館的展覽品 現在則陳列在大都會藝術博物館販售 它現在還在那裡待價而沽 這是仿擬女兒和我的模樣
(Applause)
(掌聲)
These were just some of the things I've made. I made hundreds of them for the last 75 years. I call myself a maker of things. I don't call myself an industrial designer because I'm other things. Industrial designers want to make novel things. Novelty is a concept of commerce, not an aesthetic concept. The industrial design magazine, I believe, is called "Innovation." Innovation is not part of the aim of my work. Well, makers of things: they make things more beautiful, more elegant, more comfortable than just the craftsmen do. I have so much to say. I have to think what I am going to say. Well, to describe our profession otherwise, we are actually concerned with the playful search for beauty. That means the playful search for beauty was called the first activity of Man. Sarah Smith, who was a mathematics professor at MIT, wrote, "The playful search for beauty was Man's first activity -- that all useful qualities and all material qualities were developed from the playful search for beauty." These are tiles. The word, "playful" is a necessary aspect of our work because, actually, one of our problems is that we have to make, produce, lovely things throughout all of life, and this for me is now 75 years.
這些只是我的作品中的一部分 在過去75年,我創作了上百個作品 我稱自己為這些作品的「創作者」 我不會稱自己為「工藝設計師」,因為我不太一樣 工藝設計師想要做出新奇的東西 「新奇」是商業的概念,而不是美學的概念 有本工藝設計的雜誌,我記得是叫作「創新」 但創新並非我設計的目的 所謂創作者,相較於那些工匠的作品,他們創作的東西更漂亮 更優雅、更舒適 我有好多話想說。我必須要想想我現在要說什麼 換個方式描述我們的專業 我們實際上關心的是,對於美麗事物的玩樂探索 這意味著,對美的玩樂探索,即是人類發展的第一個活動 Sarah Smith,一位麻省理工的數學教授,寫道 「人類的第一個活動,就是對於美麗事物的玩耍探索 -- 任何實用的價值和任何物質的價值 都是源自於此。」 這些就是設計的基石。這個字,「玩」,是我們這行的必備 因為,我們最大的挑戰就是我們必須 創作出討人喜愛的東西,費盡畢生心力。而對我來說,「畢生」已經是75年了
So how can you, without drying up, make things with the same pleasure, as a gift to others, for so long? The playful is therefore an important part of our quality as designer. Let me tell you some about my life. As I said, I started to do these things 75 years ago. My first exhibition in the United States was at the Sesquicentennial exhibition in 1926 -- that the Hungarian government sent one of my hand-drawn pieces as part of the exhibit. My work actually took me through many countries, and showed me a great part of the world. This is not that they took me -- the work didn't take me -- I made the things particularly because I wanted to use them to see the world. I was incredibly curious to see the world, and I made all these things, which then finally did take me to see many countries and many cultures. I started as an apprentice to a Hungarian craftsman, and this taught me what the guild system was in Middle Ages.
所以你如何才能避免創意枯竭 源源不絕地用同樣的熱情創作,每次都像是給心儀的人禮物般,永不疲倦? 所以,玩心是設計者素質高下的要素 我來談談我的人生吧 如同我剛剛所說的,我已經從業75年 我在美國第一次有作品展出 是1926年,美國獨立150周年特展 -- 匈牙利政府提供了一件我的手繪作品參展 我的作品帶領我環遊各國 讓我見識世界 這不是指它們真的帶領我 -- 我的作品並沒有「帶著」我 -- 我創作這些作品,是因為我希望透過它們看看世界 我對世界充滿好奇,於是我做出這些作品 它們也真的引領我去認識許多國家和文化 我剛入行時,是拜一位匈牙利師傅為師 這讓我領略到,中世紀時手工業的行規
The guild system: that means when I was an apprentice, I had to apprentice myself in order to become a pottery master. In my shop where I studied, or learned, there was a traditional hierarchy of master, journeyman and learned worker, and apprentice, and I worked as the apprentice. The work as an apprentice was very primitive. That means I had to actually learn every aspect of making pottery by hand. We mashed the clay with our feet when it came from the hillside. After that, it had to be kneaded. It had to then go in, kind of, a mangle. And then finally it was prepared for the throwing. And there I really worked as an apprentice. My master took me to set ovens because this was part of oven-making, oven-setting, in the time. And finally, I had received a document that I had accomplished my apprenticeship successfully, that I had behaved morally, and this document was given to me by the Guild of Roof-Coverers, Rail-Diggers, Oven-Setters, Chimney Sweeps and Potters.
行規指的是,當我還是個學徒 我必須拜師學藝,以成為一個陶器師傅 在我受訓求學的工房,有著傳統的師徒階級制 分作師傅、資深工藝師、學長和學徒 而我當時還只是個學徒 一個學徒要做的事情是很原始粗重的 意思是,我必須親手操作每一個製作陶器的流程 我們用的黏土來自山上,先經過腳踩 接著揉捏,然後經過壓榨機處理 最後就是拋摔 這些就是我作為學徒所要做的事 我的師父還會領我去搭建窯爐 當時這是學徒一定要做的 最後,我領到一份證書 證明我已順利完成我的學徒訓練 並學習不倦、尊師重道,就可以得到這份證書 授予我證書的權威代表,包括鋪設屋頂的工人、鐵路工人、搭建烤爐的工人 清理煙囪的工人,以及燒陶師傅
(Laughter)
(笑聲)
I also got at the time a workbook which explained my rights and my working conditions, and I still have that workbook. First I set up a shop in my own garden, and made pottery which I sold on the marketplace in Budapest. And there I was sitting, and my then-boyfriend -- I didn't mean it was a boyfriend like it is meant today -- but my boyfriend and I sat at the market and sold the pots. My mother thought that this was not very proper, so she sat with us to add propriety to this activity.
我當時還收到一本手冊,說明學徒的權利 以及工作待遇。這本手冊,直到現在我都還留著 學徒畢業後,我先在自己的庭院裡設立一個工作室 然後在布達佩斯販售我的陶藝作品 我坐在那裡,而我當時的男友 -- 我所說的男友,並不是今天大家所講的那種「男友」 -- 我的男友和我一起坐在市場攤位,販售陶器 我母親認為這不太妥當 所以她也來和我們坐在一起,讓這一切「妥當」一點
(Laughter)
(笑聲)
However, after a while there was a new factory being built in Budapest, a pottery factory, a large one. And I visited it with several ladies, and asked all sorts of questions of the director. Then the director asked me, why do you ask all these questions? I said, I also have a pottery. So he asked me, could he please visit me, and then finally he did, and explained to me that what I did now in my shop was an anachronism, that the industrial revolution had broken out, and that I rather should join the factory. There he made an art department for me where I worked for several months. However, everybody in the factory spent his time at the art department. The director there said there were several women casting and producing my designs now in molds, and this was sold also to America.
好景不常,沒多久布達佩斯就出現了一座新的工廠 一座陶器工廠,好大一座 我和幾個女孩子一起去參觀,纏著工廠的主任問個不停 那個主任就反問我,為什麼對這些事情這麼好奇? 我回答,因為我也有座工房 他詢問我是否能拜訪我的工作室,他也真的來了 並且向我解釋,說像我這樣的工作模式已經落伍了 工業時代已經來臨 我應該要加入工廠的行列 於是他為我創立了一個藝術部門,我也在那裡工作了幾個月 然而,工廠內的每個人都開始花時間在藝術組的任務上 主任說,有幾個女工在...鑄造 鑄模來製造我的設計作品,並銷到美國
I remember that it was quite successful. However, the director, the chemist, model maker -- everybody -- concerned himself much more with the art department -- that means, with my work -- than making toilets, so finally they got a letter from the center, from the bank who owned the factory, saying, make toilet-setting behind the art department, and that was my end. So this gave me the possibility because now I was a journeyman, and journeymen also take their satchel and go to see the world. So as a journeyman, I put an ad into the paper that I had studied, that I was a down-to-earth potter's journeyman and I was looking for a job as a journeyman. And I got several answers, and I accepted the one which was farthest from home and practically, I thought, halfway to America.
我記得在當時還蠻成功的 可是,無論是主任、化學研究員、製模工人等 -- 工廠裡的每個人 -- 都以為自己是藝術組的一員 -- 以為我設計的作品也是他們的作品 -- 而自己不再是製造馬桶的成員 後來他們就收到總部寄來的消息,是擁有公司所有權的銀行寄發的 內容說到,把藝術組歸到馬桶裝設組的管理麾下,於是這也成為我這份工作的句點。 這樣讓我在成為資深工藝師之後, 有機會帶著行囊去巡訪世界。 我在報上登了一則廣告,簡介我的資深工藝師身分、學歷 說明我是一個穩紮穩打的陶藝師 希望尋找一份資深工藝師的職務 我得到一些回音,並且接受了其中一個工作 它的位置距離我家最遠,而且在我心目中,那幾乎是從家裡到美國路途的一半
And that was in Hamburg. Then I first took this job in Hamburg, at an art pottery where everything was done on the wheel, and so I worked in a shop where there were several potters. And the first day, I was coming to take my place at the turntable -- there were three or four turntables -- and one of them, behind where I was sitting, was a hunchback, a deaf-mute hunchback, who smelled very bad. So I doused him in cologne every day, which he thought was very nice, and therefore he brought bread and butter every day, which I had to eat out of courtesy. The first day I came to work in this shop there was on my wheel a surprise for me. My colleagues had thoughtfully put on the wheel where I was supposed to work a very nicely modeled natural man's organs. (Laughter) After I brushed them off with a hand motion, they were very -- I finally was now accepted, and worked there for some six months. This was my first job. If I go on like this, you will be here till midnight.
它位於德國漢堡 我在這間位於漢堡的陶藝工房工作 在這裡,所有的作品都是在轆轤上操作 我與其他幾個工藝師一起工作 上工第一天,我正要選擇要使用的轆轤 -- 總共大概有三到四個 --發現其中一個陶藝師在我身後 他是個駝子,既聾又啞,還散發濃濃臭味 於是我每天朝他噴灑古龍水,他也感到很開心 作為回報,他每天買了麵包和奶油來 我也很禮貌地吃了 我工作的第一天 有個驚喜在我的轤轆上等著我 我的同事們在我要用來工作的轤轆上,貼心地擺上 一個非常逼真的陽具模型 (笑聲) 在我手一揮把它拍開後,他們感到非常 -- 我終於被他們接納,在那裡工作了約六個月 這就是我的第一份工作 如果我繼續用這樣的進度講故事,你們到半夜都走不了
(Laughter)
(笑聲)
(Applause)
(掌聲)
So I will try speed it up a little
所以我會試著加快一點
(Laughter)
(笑聲)
Moderator: Eva, we have about five minutes.
主持人:Eva,我們大概只剩五分鐘
(Laughter)
(笑聲)
Eva Zeisel: Are you sure?
Eva Zeisel: 你是認真的嗎?
Moderator: Yes, I am sure.
主持人:對,我很確定
EZ: Well, if you are sure, I have to tell you that within five minutes I will talk very fast. And actually, my work took me to many countries because I used my work to fill my curiosity. And among other things, other countries I worked, was in the Soviet Union, where I worked from '32 to '37 -- actually, to '36. I was finally there, although I had nothing to do -- I was a foreign expert. I became art director of the china and glass industry, and eventually under Stalin's purges -- at the beginning of Stalin's purges, I didn't know that hundreds of thousands of innocent people were arrested. So I was arrested quite early in Stalin's purges, and spent 16 months in a Russian prison. The accusation was that I had successfully prepared an Attentat on Stalin's life. This was a very dangerous accusation. And if this is the end of my five minutes, I want to tell you that I actually did survive, which was a surprise. But since I survived and I'm here, and since this is the end of the five minutes, I will --
EZ:好吧,如果你確定的話 我必須告訴你們,在接下來的五分鐘我會講得非常快 事實上,我的工作讓我造訪了許多國家 我藉由工作滿足我的好奇心 在這些作品、這些旅居過的國家中,我曾在蘇聯工作 從1932到1937年 -- 應該是1936年 我終於到了蘇聯,雖然我也沒有特殊的期待或目的 -- 我算是外國專家 在那裡擔任陶瓷和玻璃工業的藝術總監 後來在史達林的整肅之下 -- 史達林剛開始實施整肅運動時 我並不知道成千上萬的無辜民眾被銬上手撩 所以在大整肅期間,我是最早被逮捕的其中一人 在俄國監獄蹲了16個月 我的罪名是,預謀行刺史達林 這是很嚴重的指控 如果這是我演講的最後5分鐘,我想要分享這件事 我很訝異自己後來竟大難不死 不過既然我度過這個難關,來到了這裡 既然這是最後五分鐘,我要 --
Moderator: Tell me when your last trip to Russia was. Weren't you there recently?
主持人:請告訴我們妳最近一次到俄國是什麼時候 好像最近才去過?
EZ: Oh, this summer, in fact, the Lomonosov factory was bought by an American company, invited me. They found out that I had worked in '33 at this factory, and they came to my studio in Rockland County, and brought the 15 of their artists to visit me here. And they invited myself to come to the Russian factory last summer, in July, to make some dishes, design some dishes. And since I don't like to travel alone, they also invited my daughter, son-in-law and granddaughter, so we had a lovely trip to see Russia today, which is not a very pleasant and happy view. Here I am now, if this is the end? Thank you.
EZ:噢事實上,是今年夏天 羅蒙諾索夫工廠被一間美商買下,他們邀請我過去 他們得知我曾於1933年在羅蒙諾索夫工作過 他們來到我在羅克蘭縣的工作室 帶著他們的15位藝術家來拜訪我 並邀請我於隔年夏天去參訪他們 七月份的時候,去設計一些杯盤餐具 因為我不愛一個人旅行,所以他們也一併邀請我的女兒 女婿和孫女 所以我們全家有個愉快的旅程,看到了今日的俄國 那不是一個快樂和諧的景象 講到這裡,差不多算結束了? 謝謝大家
(Applause)
(掌聲)