First of all, thank you for your attention. There's nothing quite like being in a room full of people like this, where all of you are giving your attention to me. It's a powerful feeling, to get attention. I'm an actor, so I'm a bit of an expert on, well, nothing, really.
首先,謝謝大家的關注。 在一間大廳中,滿是這樣的觀眾, 大家都把注意力給我, 是種很獨特的體驗。 獲得關注是一種很強大的感受。 我是演員,所以我對什麼 都懂得不深,嗯,真的。
(Laughter)
(笑聲)
But I do know what it feels like to get attention -- I've been lucky in my life to get a lot more than my fair share of attention. And I'm grateful for that, because like I said, it's a powerful feeling. But there's another powerful feeling that I've also been lucky to experience a lot as an actor. And it's funny, it's sort of the opposite feeling, because it doesn't come from getting attention. It comes from paying attention.
但我確實知道被關注是什麼感覺—— 我這一生都很幸運, 一直能得到大家的關注。 我對此很感恩, 就像我剛說的, 這是種很強大的感覺。 但,身為演員,我也很幸運 能夠體驗到另一種強大的感受。 很有趣,它可以說 是種相反的感受, 因為它並不是來自得到關注。 它來自專注。
When I'm acting, I get so focused that I'm only paying attention to one thing. Like when I'm on set and we're about to shoot and the first AD calls out "Rolling!" And then I hear "speed," "marker," "set," and then the director calls "Action!" I've heard that sequence so many times, like, it's become this Pavlovian magic spell for me. "Rolling," "speed," "marker," "set" and "action." Something happens to me, I can't even help it. My attention ... narrows. And everything else in the world, anything else that might be bothering me or might grab my attention, it all goes away, and I'm just ... there. And that feeling, that is what I love, that, to me, is creativity. And that's the biggest reason I'm so grateful that I get to be an actor.
當我在演戲時, 我會非常專注到 只把注意力放在一件事上。 比如,當我在片場, 我們準備要開拍, 第一副導演喊 「Rolling(攝影機運轉)!」 接著,我聽到「速度」、 「場記板」、「就緒」, 接著,導演喊「開拍!」 我太常聽到這一連串術語, 對我來說就變成 像是魔法咒語一樣。 「攝影機運轉」、 「速度」、「場記板」、 「就緒」、「開拍」。 我會發生一種無法控制的狀況。 我的注意力…… 會變狹窄。 世界上的所有其他一切, 任何可能會打擾我 或吸引我注意的東西, 全都不見了, 我就只是……在當下。 我愛的就是那種感覺, 對我來說,那就是創意。 那就是我很感謝我能夠 成為演員的最大理由。
So, there's these two powerful feelings. There's getting attention and paying attention. Of course, in the last decade or so, new technology has allowed more and more people to have this powerful feeling of getting attention. For any kind of creative expression, not just acting. It could be writing or photography or drawing, music -- everything. The channels of distribution have been democratized, and that's a good thing.
所以,有這兩種很強大的感受。 獲得關注,以及專注當下。 當然,大約在前十年, 新科技技術讓更多人 嚐到獲得關注的感受。 包括任何類型的創意 表現,不只是演戲。 如寫作、攝影、 畫畫、音樂——什麼都行。 銷售的管道被大眾化了, 那是好事。
But I do think there's an unintended consequence for anybody on the planet with an urge to be creative -- myself included, because I'm not immune to this. I think that our creativity is becoming more and more of a means to an end -- and that end is to get attention. And so I feel compelled to speak up because in my experience, the more I go after that powerful feeling of paying attention, the happier I am. But the more I go after the powerful feeling of getting attention, the unhappier I am.
但,我認為這發展對於 地球上任何有強烈慾望 想要發揮創意的人, 會造成非預期的後果—— 包括我自己在內也不能倖免。 我認為,我們的創意 變得越來越像是達到目的的手段—— 那目的就是獲得關注。 所以我覺得我必須站出來說明,因為, 根據我的經驗, 我越是去追求專注的強大感受, 我就越快樂。 但我越是去追求得到 關注的強大感受, 我就越不快樂。
(One person claps)
(一個人的掌聲)且——謝謝。
And -- thanks.
(Laughter)
(笑聲)
(Applause)
(掌聲)
So this is something that goes way back for me. I think the first time I can remember using my acting to get attention, I was eight years old at summer camp. And I'd been going on auditions for about a year by then, and I'd been lucky to get some small parts in TV shows and commercials, and I bragged about it a lot, that summer at camp. And at first, it worked. The other kids gave me a bunch of extra attention, because I had been on "Family Ties." That's a picture of me on "Family Ties."
對我來說,這要追溯到好久以前。 在我的記憶中,我第一次 靠表演得到注意力, 是我八歲參加夏令營的時候。 那時我已經有一年 左右的試鏡經驗了, 我很幸運,在電視節目 和廣告中演出一些小角色, 在夏令營時我常常吹噓這些事。 一開始,這麼做行得通。 其他孩子給了我 大量的額外注意力, 因為我演過《天才家庭》。 這是在《天才家庭》裡面的我。
(Laughter)
(笑聲)
Then, the tide turned -- I think I took it too far with the bragging. And then, the other kids started to make fun of me. I remember there was this one girl I had a crush on, Rocky. Her name was Rachel, she went by Rocky. And she was beautiful, and she could sing, and I was smitten with her, and I was standing there, bragging. And she turned to me and she called me a show-off. Which I 100 percent deserved. But you know, it still really hurt. And ever since that summer, I've had a certain hesitance to seek attention for my acting.
接著,情勢轉變了—— 我想我吹噓得太過頭了。 接著,其他孩子開始嘲笑我。 我還記得有一個女孩 叫洛基,我在暗戀她。 她的名字是瑞秋,小名叫洛基。 她很漂亮,且很會唱歌, 我好喜歡她, 我就站在那裡,吹噓著。 她轉向我,她說我是個愛現鬼。 我百分之百罪有應得。 但,要知道,那真的很痛。 從那個夏天之後, 我都會猶豫要不要靠表演 來獲得大家的注意力。
Sometimes, people would ask me, "Wait a minute, if you don't like the attention, then why are you an actor?" And I'd be like, "Because that's not what acting's about, man, it's about the art." And they'd be like, "OK, OK, dude."
有時,會有人問我: 「等等,若你不喜歡 備受關注,為何要當演員?」 我就會:「因為演戲不是為了這個, 是為藝術啊。」 他們就會說:「好,好,老兄。」
(Laughter)
(笑聲)
And then Twitter came out. And I got totally hooked on it, just like everybody else, which made me into a complete hypocrite. Because at that point, I was absolutely using my acting to get attention. I mean, what, did I think I was just getting all these followers because of my brilliant tweets? I actually did think that -- I was like --
接著,推特出現了。 和大家一樣,我完全迷上了它, 讓我完全變成了偽君子。 因為,在那時,我完全 靠演戲來獲得關注。 我的意思是,什麼, 我以為是因為我的精采推文, 才得到這麼多粉絲? 我當時真的那麼想——我心想——
(Laughter)
(笑聲)
"They don't just like me because they saw me in 'Batman,' they like what I have to say, I've got a way with words."
「他們不只是因為我演過 《蝙蝠俠》所以喜歡我, 他們喜歡我說的話, 我很能言善道。」
(Laughter)
(笑聲)
And then in no time at all, it started having an impact on my dearly beloved creative process. It still does. I try not to let it. But you know, I'd be sitting there, like, reading a script. And instead of thinking, "How can I personally identify with this character?" Or "How is the audience going to relate to this story?" I'm like, "What are people going to say about this movie on Twitter?" And "What will I say back that will be good and snarky enough to get a lot of retweets, but not too harsh, because people love to get offended, and I don't want to get canceled?" These are the thoughts that enter my mind when I'm supposed to be reading a script, trying to be an artist.
接著,沒多久, 這就開始對於我心愛的 創意過程產生了影響。 現在仍然有影響。 我試著不讓它造成影響。 但,我就坐在那裡, 比如正在讀劇本。 我並不是在想: 「我個人要如何 和這個角色產生連結?」 或者「觀眾要如何才能 和這個故事有所連結?」 我想的卻是:「大家在推特上 會怎麼說這部電影?」 及「我要怎麼回應 才夠好、夠犀利, 能得到許多回推, 但又不要太嚴厲, 因為人們喜歡吐槽, 但我不想被取消追蹤?」 我腦中盡是這些想法, 特別是當我本該讀劇本、 努力當一個藝術家時。 我來這裡並不是要告訴各位 科技是創意的敵人。
And I'm not here to tell you that technology is the enemy of creativity. I don't think that. I think tech is just a tool. It has the potential to foster unprecedented human creativity. Like, I even started an online community called HITRECORD, where people all over the world collaborate on all kinds of creative projects, so I don't think that social media or smartphones or any technology is problematic in and of itself. But ... if we're going to talk about the perils of creativity becoming a means to get attention, then we have to talk about the attention-driven business model of today's big social media companies, right?
我不這麼想。 科技只是工具。 它有潛力可以促進 前所未有的人類創意。 比如,我甚至成立了一個 線上社群叫做 HITRECORD, 在那裡,來自全世界的人 能合作進行各種創意計畫, 所以我不認為社交媒體、手機, 或任何技術本身是有問題的。 但…… 如果我們要討論,當創意變成是 獲得關注的手段時是多危險的事, 那麼,我們就必須要談到 現今大型社交媒體公司 採用了一些注意力導向的 商業模式,對吧?
(Applause)
(掌聲)
This will be familiar territory for some of you, but it's a really relevant question here: How does a social media platform like, for example, Instagram, make money? It's not selling a photo-sharing service -- that part's free. So what is it selling? It's selling attention. It's selling the attention of its users to advertisers. And there's a lot of discussion right now about how much attention we're all giving to things like Instagram, but my question is: How is Instagram getting so much attention?
在座有些人可能很熟悉這個領域, 但,這個問題很重要: 社交媒體平台, 如 IG,要如何賺錢? 不是銷售照片分享服務—— 那部分是免費的。 那它銷售的是什麼?是注意力。 它在把使用者的注意力 銷售給廣告商。 現在有許多討論 都是在談我們大家給了 IG 這類平台多少注意力, 但,我的問題是:IG 怎麼能 得到這麼多注意力?
We get it for them. Anytime somebody posts on Instagram, they get a certain amount of attention from their followers, whether they have a few followers or a few million followers. And the more attention you're able to get, the more attention Instagram is able to sell. So it's in Instagram's interest for you to get as much attention as possible. And so it trains you to want that attention, to crave it, to feel stressed out when you're not getting enough of it. Instagram gets its users addicted to the powerful feeling of getting attention. And I know we all joke, like, "Oh my God, I'm so addicted to my phone," but this is a real addiction. There's a whole science to it. If you're curious, I recommend the work of Jaron Lanier, Tristan Harris, Nir Eyal.
是我們幫它取得的。 每當有人在 IG 上發表貼文, 他們就會從追隨者那邊 得到一定量的關注, 不論是只有幾個追隨者 或有幾百萬個追隨者。 而你能得到越多關注, IG 能銷售的關注就越多。 就 IG 的利益來說, 盡可能得到你越多注意力越好。 所以 IG 會訓練你,讓你渴望得到關注。 當你獲得的關注不夠時, 你就會覺得很有壓力。 IG 讓它的使用者上癮, 對這種得到關注的強大感受上癮。 我們都會這樣開玩笑:「喔,天啊, 我對我的手機上癮了。」 但這是一種真正的上癮。 背後有完整的科學。 如果你想知道, 我建議看看傑倫·拉尼爾、 特里斯坦·哈里斯、尼爾·艾歐的作品。
But here's what I can tell you. Being addicted to getting attention is just like being addicted to anything else. It's never enough. You start out and you're thinking, "If only I had 1,000 followers, that would feel amazing." But then you're like, "Well, once I get to 10,000 followers," and, "Once I get to 100 -- Once I get to a million followers, then I'll feel amazing."
但,我能告訴各位的是: 對於「得到注意力」上癮 和對其他事物上癮是一樣的。 永遠都會嫌不夠。 你開始上癮,你心想: 「我若能有一千個追隨者, 感覺會超棒。」 但,接著你會想:「一旦 我能得到一萬個追隨者,」 然後「一旦我得到一百—— 一旦我有一百萬個 追隨者,感覺會超棒。」
So I have 4.2 million followers on Twitter -- it's never made me feel amazing. I'm not going to tell you how many I have on Instagram, because I feel genuine shame about how low the number is, because I joined Instagram after "Batman" came out.
我在推特上有 四千兩百萬個追隨者—— 那從來沒有讓我感覺很棒。 我不打算告訴各位 我在 IG 上有多少追隨者, 因為我真的覺得 那數字低得很可恥, 因為我在《蝙蝠俠》 推出後加入 IG。
(Laughter)
(笑聲)
And I search other actors, and I see that their number is higher than mine, and it makes me feel terrible about myself. Because the follower count makes everybody feel terrible about themselves. That feeling of inadequacy is what drives you to post, so you can get more attention, and then that attention that you get is what these companies sell, that's how they make their money. So there is no amount of attention you can get where you feel like you've arrived, and you're like, "Ah, I'm good now."
我搜尋了其他演員, 我發現他們的數字比我的高, 那讓我覺得自己很糟糕。 因為追隨者數目 會讓每個人覺得自己很糟糕。 那種不足感,會讓你想要貼文, 讓你得到更多關注, 接著,你得到的關注 就成了這些公司的產品, 它們就是這樣賺錢的。 所以不論你得到多少關注, 你都不會覺得滿足, 說:「啊,我現在這樣就好了。」
And of course, there are a lot of actors who are more famous than I am, have more followers than I do, but I bet you they would tell you the same thing. If your creativity is driven by a desire to get attention, you're never going to be creatively fulfilled.
當然,有很多演員比我還出名, 粉絲數目也比我多, 但我敢說,他們也會 告訴各位同樣的話。 如果你的創意是被 獲得關注的慾望所驅使, 那你永遠不會有創作的成就感。
But I do have some good news. There is this other powerful feeling. Something else you can do with your attention besides letting a giant tech company control it and sell it. This is that feeling I was talking about, why I love acting so much -- it's being able to pay attention to just one thing.
但,我有些好消息。 有另一種強大的感受。 你可以把你的注意力 做另一種用途, 而不是讓大型科技公司 控制它、銷售它。 那就是我先前談的那種感受, 我熱愛演戲的原因—— 就是把注意力放在一件事情上。
Turns out there's actually some science behind this too. Psychologists and neuroscientists -- they study a phenomenon they call flow, which is this thing that happens in the human brain when someone pays attention to just one thing, like something creative, and manages not to get distracted by anything else. And some say the more regularly you do this, the happier you'll be.
結果發現這背後 也是有科學根據的。 心理學家和神經科學家—— 他們研究所謂的 「心流(flow)」, 它是大腦中發生的一種現象, 當你把注意力放在一件事情上, 如創作類的事情, 且能做到不要被任何 其它事分心時就會發生。 有人說,你越常這麼做, 你就會越快樂。
Now I'm not a psychologist or a neuroscientist. But I can tell you, for me, that is very true. It's not always easy, it's hard. To really pay attention like this takes practice, everybody does it their own way. But if there's one thing I can share that I think helps me focus and really pay attention, it's this: I try not to see other creative people as my competitors. I try to find collaborators. Like, if I'm acting in a scene, if I start seeing the other actors as my competitors, and I'm like, "God, they're going to get more attention than I am, people are going to be talking about their performance more than mine" -- I've lost my focus. And I'm probably going to suck in that scene.
我不是心理學家或神經科學家。 但我可以告訴各位, 對我來說真的就是如此。 不見得都很容易,這很困難。 要像這樣真正地集中注意力 是需要練習的, 每個人有自己的方式。 但,若要我分享幫助我專注, 幫助我真正能 集中注意力的,那就是: 我試著不要把其他創作者 視為我的競爭者。 我試著去找合作對象。 比如,如果我在演一個橋段。 如果我開始把其他演員 視為我的競爭者,心想: 「天,他們會取得 比我更多的注意力, 大家會談論他們的演出, 不是談我的」—— 我就失焦了。 那個橋段我大概也會演得很爛。
But when I see the other actors as collaborators, then it becomes almost easy to focus, because I'm just paying attention to them. And I don't have to think about what I'm doing -- I react to what they're doing, they react to what I'm doing, and we can kind of keep each other in it together. But I don't want you to think it's only actors on a set that can collaborate in this way. I could be in whatever kind of creative situation. It could be professional, could be just for fun. I could be collaborating with people I'm not even in the same room with. In fact, some of my favorite things I've ever made, I made with people that I never physically met.
但,若我能把其他演員 視為合作對象, 那麼,要專注就很容易, 因為我只要專注在他們身上。 我不用去想我要做什麼—— 我針對他們所做的來反應, 他們對我所做的來反應, 我們就能夠一起保持 融入在這個橋段中。 但,我不希望各位覺得 只有片場演員才能這樣子合作。 在任何創作情境當中都有可能, 可能是專業的情境, 可能只是好玩的情境。 我有可能和身在其他地方的人合作。 事實上,有些我最喜歡的成果 是和我沒有實際見過面的人合作的。
And by the way, this, to me, is the beauty of the internet. If we could just stop competing for attention, then the internet becomes a great place to find collaborators. And once I'm collaborating with other people, whether they're on set, or online, wherever, that makes it so much easier for me to find that flow, because we're all just paying attention to the one thing that we're making together. And I fell like I'm part of something larger than myself, and we all sort of shield each other from anything else that might otherwise grab our attention, and we can all just be there.
順道一提,對我來說, 這就是網路的美好之處。 如果我們能夠停止爭奪注意力, 那麼網路就會變成 找到合作對象的好地方。 一旦我開始和其他人合作, 不論是在片場、線上、任何地方, 對我來說,找到那心流 變得容易許多, 因為我們只要集中注意力, 專注在我們共同進行的 那一件事情上就可以了。 我覺得我是某個比我自己 更大的大我的一部分, 我們都會協助彼此 排除其他可能會搶走 我們注意力的事物, 我們全都能做到 人在那裡,心也在那裡。
At least that's what works for me. Sometimes. Sometimes -- it doesn't always work. Sometimes, I still totally get wrapped up in that addictive cycle of wanting to get attention. I mean, like, even right now, can I honestly say there's not some part of me here who's like, "Hey, everybody, look at me, I'm giving a TED Talk!"
至少那對我來說是有用的。 有時啦,不見得總是有用。 有時,我也會整個陷入那種 想要獲得關注的上癮循環裡。 就連現在, 我必須要誠實說, 某部分的我也在心想: 「嘿,各位,看看我, 我在 TED 演講哪!」
(Laughter)
(笑聲)
There is -- there's, you know, some part. But I can also honestly say that this whole creative process of writing and giving this talk, it's been a huge opportunity for me to focus and really pay attention to something I care a lot about.
總是有某個這樣的部分。 但我也要誠實說, 撰寫講稿,來這裡演說的 這整個創作過程, 對我來說是個很大的 機會,讓我能專注, 真正把注意力放在 我非常關心的事情上。
So regardless of how much attention I do or don't get as a result, I'm happy I did it. And I'm grateful to all of you for letting me. So thank you, that's it, you can give your attention to someone else now.
所以,不論最後我得到 或沒得到多少關注, 我都很高興我做了這件事。 我也很感激各位讓我來演講。 謝謝,就這樣了, 現在各位可以把 你們的注意力給別人了。
Thanks again.
再次感謝。
(Applause)
(掌聲)