Bryn Freedman: So you said that in the 20th century, global power was in the hands of government. At the beginning of this digital century, it really moved to corporations and that in the future, it would move to individuals. And I've interviewed a lot of people, and they say you're wrong, and they are betting on the companies. So why are you right, and why are individuals going to win out?
Bryn Freedman: Rekli ste da u 20. stoljeću globalna moć je bila u rukama vlade. Na početku ovog digitalnog stoljeća, stvarno je prešla na korporacije i u budućnosti će prijeći na pojedince. Intervjuirala sam puno ljudi i kažu da ste u krivu, oni se klade na kompanije. Dakle, zašto ste Vi u pravu i zašto će pojedinci pobijediti?
Fadi Chehadé: Because companies cater to individuals, and we as the citizenry need to start understanding that we have a big role in shaping how the world will be governed, moving forward. Yes, indeed, the tug of war right now is between governments, who lost much of their power to companies because the internet is not built around the nation-state system around which governments have power. The internet is transnational. It's not international, and it's not national, and therefore the companies became very powerful. They shape our economy. They shape our society. Governments don't know what to do. Right now, they're reacting. And I fear that if we do not, as the citizenry -- which are, in my opinion, the most important leg of that stool -- don't take our role, then you are right. The detractors, or the people telling you that businesses will prevail, are right. It will happen.
Fadi Chehadé: Jer kompanije opslužuju pojedince, a mi kao građani moramo shvatiti da imamo veliku ulogu u tome kako će se svijet voditi, kročiti naprijed. Da, poteže se konop između vlada kojima su kompanije preuzele puno moći, jer internet nije građen oko nacionalnog sustava oko kojeg vlade imaju moć. Internet je transnacionalni. Nije internacionalni, nije nacionalni, i zbog toga su kompanije postale vrlo moćne. One oblikuju naš gospodarski sustav. One oblikuju naše društvo. Vlade ne znaju što da rade. Trenutno, odgovaraju, reagiraju. Bojim se da ako mi kao građani -- koji smo, po mom mišljenju, najvažniji dio jednadžbe -- ne preuzimamo svoju ulogu, onda ste u pravu. Klevetnici, ili ljudi koji vam govore da će poslovanje prevladati, su u pravu. To će se dogoditi.
BF: So are you saying that individuals will force businesses or business will be forced to be responsive, or is there a fear that they won't be?
BF: Znači, vi govorite da će pojedinci gurati poslovanje ili će poslovanje biti prisiljeno da više reagira, ili postoji strah da toga neće biti?
FC: I think they will be. Look at two weeks ago, a small company called Skip winning over Uber and Lyft and everyone to actually get the license for the San Francisco scooter business. And if you read why did Skip win, because Skip listened to the people of San Francisco, who were tired of scooters being thrown everywhere, and actually went to the city and said, "We will deploy the service, but we will respond to the people's requirements that we organize ourselves around a set of rules." They self-governed their behavior, and they won the contract over some very powerful companies.
FC: Ja mislim da hoće. Pogledajte, prije dva tjedna, mala tvrtka zvana Skip je pobijedila Uber, Lyft i druge te dobila dozvolu za poslovanje skuterima u San Franciscu. I ako pročitate zašto je Skip pobijedio, to je zato što je Skip slušao ljude San Francisca, kojima je već dojadilo da se skuteri posvuda ostavljaju, otišli su u upravu grada i rekli, "Mi ćemo razviti uslugu, ali ćemo se prilagođavati zahtjevima ljudi i organizirati se oko skupa pravila." Sami su se dogovorili i dobili ugovor pored nekih jako moćnih kompanija.
BF: So speaking of guidelines and self-governance, you've spent an entire lifetime creating guidelines and norms for the internet. Do you think those days are over? Who is going to guide, who is going to control, and who is going to create those norms?
BF: Govoreći o odrednicama i samo-upravljanju, potrošili ste cijeli životni vijek stvarajući norme i odrednice za internet. Mislite li da su ti dani prošli? Tko će voditi, tko će kontrolirati i tko će stvoriti te norme?
FC: The rules that govern the technology layers of the internet are now well put in place, and I was very busy for a few years setting those rules around the part of the internet that makes the internet one network. The domain-name system, the IP numbers, all of that is in place. However, as we get now into the upper layers of the internet, the issues that affect me and you every day -- privacy, security, etc. -- the system to create norms for those unfortunately is not in place. So we do have an issue. We have a system of cooperation and governance that really needs to be created right now so that companies, governments and the citizenry can agree how this new digital world is going to advance.
FC: Pravila koja upravljaju tehnološkim slojevima interneta su sada dobro posložena i par godina sam imao puno posla oko postavljanja tih pravila, oko dijela interneta koji ga čini jednom mrežom. Imena domena, IP brojevi i sve to je na svom mjestu. Međutim, kako dolazimo do gornjih slojeva interneta, problemi koji utječu na mene i na Vas svaki dan -- privatnost, sigurnost, itd. -- sustav koji za to stvara norme nije na mjestu. Tako da imamo problem. Imamo sustav suradnje i upravljanja koji se treba odmah stvoriti, tako da se kompanije, vlade i građani slože kako će ovaj novi digitalni svijet napredovati.
BF: So what gives a digital company any incentive? Let's say -- Facebook comes to mind -- they would say they have their users' best interests at heart, but I think a lot of people would disagree with that.
BF: Što daje digitalnoj kompaniji ikakav poticaj? Recimo, na pamet mi pada Facebook, oni bi rekli da brinu za interes korisnika, ali mislim da se puno ljudi ne bi složilo s tim.
FC: It's been very difficult to watch how tech companies have reacted to the citizenry's response to their technologies. And some of them, two or three years ago, basically dismissed it. The word that I heard in many board rooms is, "We're just a technology platform. It's not my issue if my technology platform causes families to go kill their girls in Pakistan. It's not my issue. It's their problem. I just have a technology platform." Now, I think we are now entering a stage where companies are starting to realize this is no longer sustainable, and they're starting to see the pushback that's coming from people, users, citizens, but also governments that are starting to say, "This cannot be."
FC: Bilo je jako teško gledati kako su tehnološke kompanije reagirale na odgovor građana na njihovu tehnologiju. I neki od njih su ih otkazali prije dvije ili tri godine. U brojnim salama za sastanke čuo sam: "Mi smo samo tehnološka platforma. Nije moj problem ako zbog moje tehnološke platforme obitelji u Pakistanu ubijaju svoje djevojke. Nije moj problem. Njihov je. Ja samo imam tehnološku platformu." Mislim da sad ulazimo u fazu gdje kompanije počinju shvaćati da ovo više nije održivo i počinju vidjeti negativne reakcije koje dolaze od ljudi, korisnika, građana, ali također i vlada, koje počinju govoriti, "Ovo ne može ovako."
So I think there is a maturity that is starting to set, especially in that Silicon Valley area, where people are beginning to say, "We have a role." So when I speak to these leaders, I say, "Look, you could be the CEO, a very successful CEO of a company, but you could also be a steward." And that's the key word. "You could be a steward of the power you have to shape the lives and the economies of billions of people. Which one do you want to be?" And the answer is, it's not one or the other. This is what we are missing right now. So when an adult like Brad Smith, the president of Microsoft, said a few months ago, "We need a new set of Geneva Conventions to manage the security of the digital space," many of the senior leaders in Silicon Valley actually spoke against his words. "What do you mean, Geneva Convention? We don't need any Geneva Conventions. We self-regulate." But that mood is changing, and I'm starting to see many leaders say, "Help us out." But here lies the conundrum. Who is going to help those leaders do the right thing?
Mislim da postoji zrelost koja se počinje nazirati, pogotovo u području Silicijske doline, gdje ljudi počinju govoriti, "Mi imamo ulogu." Tako da, kada ja pričam s tim vođama, kažem, "Gledajte, mogli biste biti direktor, vrlo uspješan direktor kompanije, ali biste mogli biti i upravitelj." I to je ključna riječ. "Mogli biste biti upravitelj moći koju imate da oblikujete živote i gospodarstva milijardi ljudi. Koje biste htjeli biti?" Odgovor je, ni jedno, ni drugo. To je ono što sada propuštamo. Kada je odrasla osoba poput Brada Smitha, predsjednika Microsofta, nedavno rekla, "Trebamo novi set Ženevskih konvencija kako bismo upravljali sigurnošću digitalnog prostora", puno starijih vođa Silicijske doline zapravo su pričali protiv njegovih riječi. "Kako mislite Ženevska konvencija? Ne trebamo Ženevsku konvenciju. Upravljamo sami sobom." Ali to raspoloženje se mijenja i ja počinjem vidjeti puno vođa koji kažu: "Pomozite nam." Ali tu je zagonetka. Tko će pomoći tim vođama da učine pravu stvar?
BF: So who is going to help them? Because I'd love to interview you for an hour, but give me your biggest fear and your best hope for how this is going to work out.
BF: Tko će im pomoći? Jer ja bih voljela intervjuirati Vas čitav sat, ali recite mi svoj najveći strah i najveću nadu za to kako će ovo završiti.
FC: My biggest hope is that we will become each stewards of this new digital world. That's my biggest hope, because I do think, often, we want to put the blame on others. "Oh, it's these CEOs. They're behaving this way." "These governments are not doing enough." But how about us? How is each of us actually taking the responsibility to be a steward of the digital space we live in? And one of the things I've been pushing on university presidents is we need every engineering and science and computer science student who is about to write the next line of code or design the next IoT device to actually have in them a sense of responsibility and stewardship towards what they're building. So I suggested we create a new oath, like the Hippocratic Oath, so that every student entering an engineering program takes a technocratic oath or a wisdom oath or some oath of commitment to the rest of us. That's my best hope, that we all rise. Because governments and businesses will fight over this power game, but where are we? And unless we play into that power table, I think we'll end up in a bad place.
FC: Moja najveća nada je da ćemo mi postati upravitelji ovog novog digitalnog svijeta. To je moja najveća nada, jer mislim da često želimo okriviti druge za sve. "Direktori su krivi. Oni se tako ponašaju." "Vlade ne rade dovoljno." Ali što je s nama? Kako svatko od nas preuzima ulogu upravitelja digitalnog prostora u kojem živimo? Jednu od stvari koje učim predsjednike sveučilišta je potreba da svaki inženjer i student znanosti ili računarstva, koji će uskoro napisati neki novi kôd ili dizajnirati novi IoT uređaj, ima osjećaj odgovornosti i vođenja prema onome što stvara. Predložio sam da stvorimo zakletvu, poput Hipokratove zakletve, tako da svaki student koji započne studij inženjerstva prisegne na tehnokratsku zakletvu ili zakletvu mudrosti, ili nekakvu zakletvu koja ih obvezuje prema nama. To je moja najveća nada, da ćemo se svi uzdići. Jer vlade i kompanije se bore u ovoj borbi moći, ali što mi radimo? Ako se ne uključimo u borbu moći, mislim da ćemo loše završiti.
My biggest fear? My biggest fear, to be very tactical today, what is keeping me up at night is the current war between the West, the liberal world, and China, in the area of artificial intelligence. There is a real war going on, and for those of us who have lived through the nuclear nonproliferation age and saw how people agreed to take some very dangerous things off the table, well, the Carnegie Endowment just finished a study. They talked to every country that made nuclear weapons and asked them, "Which digital 'weapon' would you take off the table against somebody else's schools or hospitals?" And the answer -- from every nuclear power -- to this question was, nothing. That's what I'm worried about ... The weaponization of the digital space, and the race to get there.
Moj najveći strah? Moj najveći strah, da budem vrlo taktičan, što me drži budnim noćima, je trenutni rat između zapada, liberalnog svijeta, i Kine, u području umjetne inteligencije. Rat je stvaran, i za nas koji smo doživjeli doba ograničenja nuklearnog oružja i vidjeli kako su se ljudi složili zabraniti nešto jako opasno, Carnegie Endowment je upravo završio istraživanje. Svaku zemlju koja je proizvela nuklearno oružje pitali su, "Koje digitalno 'oružje' biste zabranili protiv tuđih škola ili bolnica?" I odgovor -- svake od tih nuklearnih sila na ovo pitanje je bilo, ništa. Toga se ja bojim... Naoružanje digitalnog prostora i utrka da se dođe do toga.
BF: Well, it sounds like you've got a lot of work to do, and so do the rest of us. Fadi, thank you so much. I really appreciate it.
BF: Izgleda da je pred Vama puno posla, kao i pred nama ostalima. Fadi, puno Vam hvala. Zaista to cijenim.
FC: Thank you.
FC: Hvala.
(Applause)
(Pljesak)