Well, this is a really extraordinary honor for me. I spend most of my time in jails, in prisons, on death row. I spend most of my time in very low-income communities, in the projects and places where there's a great deal of hopelessness. And being here at TED and seeing the stimulation, hearing it, has been very, very energizing to me. And one of the things that's emerged in my short time here is that TED has an identity. And you can actually say things here that have impacts around the world. And sometimes when it comes through TED, it has meaning and power that it doesn't have when it doesn't.
很榮幸來到這裡。 我大部分的時間都待在 看守所、監獄,或者死囚牢房中。 我也花很多時間參與低收入戶社區的計畫, 或者到一些充滿絕望的地方工作。 今天來到TED會場, 所看到的,聽見的訊息, 十分激勵人心。 在我短暫到訪的時間內,我意識到, TED具有自己獨特的定位。 你在這裡說的話 可以影響整個世界。 透過TED傳送的訊息, 它的重要性和力量 大於別的傳播平台。
And I mention that because I think identity is really important. And we've had some fantastic presentations. And I think what we've learned is that, if you're a teacher, your words can be meaningful, but if you're a compassionate teacher, they can be especially meaningful. If you're a doctor, you can do some good things, but if you're a caring doctor, you can do some other things. So I want to talk about the power of identity. And I didn't learn about this actually practicing law and doing the work that I do. I actually learned about this from my grandmother.
提到這個,是因為我認為自我定位是非常重要的。 我們已經聽過一些十分美妙的演講, 我想我們已經瞭解, 如果你是老師,你說的話會變得有影響力; 但如果你是一個富有同情心的老師, 你的話會更別具意義意。 如果你是醫生,你可以做些好事; 但如果你是有愛心的醫生,你可以做的更多。 所以我要談關於自我定位的力量。 其實我不是在工作中 學習到這些的。 實際上,我是從我外婆身上學到的。
I grew up in a house that was the traditional African American home that was dominated by a matriarch, and that matriarch was my grandmother. She was tough, she was strong, she was powerful. She was the end of every argument in our family.
我在一個 傳統的非裔美國家庭中長大, 我的外婆 掌管家中大小事。 她既強悍又硬朗, 很有權威。 家中所有紛爭都由她收尾,做最終定奪。
(Laughter)
同樣的,家中很多的爭吵也是她起的頭。
She was the beginning of a lot of arguments in our family.
她是奴隸的女兒。
(Laughter)
She was the daughter of people who were actually enslaved. Her parents were born in slavery in Virginia in the 1840s. She was born in the 1880s, and the experience of slavery very much shaped the way she saw the world.
她的父母在1840年代出生於 維吉尼亞洲,生下來就是奴隸。 她出生於1880年代, 過去身為奴隸的經歷 構成她看待世界的方式。 我外婆雖然強悍,但她也很慈愛。
And my grandmother was tough, but she was also loving. When I would see her as a little boy, she'd come up to me and give me these hugs. And she'd squeeze me so tight I could barely breathe, and then she'd let me go. And an hour or two later, if I saw her, she'd come over to me and say, "Bryan, do you still feel me hugging you?" If I said, "No," she'd assault me again, and if I said, "Yes," she'd leave me alone. And she just had this quality that you always wanted to be near her. And the only challenge was that she had 10 children. My mom was the youngest of her 10 kids. And sometimes when I would go and spend time with her, it would be difficult to get her time and attention. My cousins would be running around everywhere.
當我小的時候, 她見到我時,總是過來擁抱我。 她緊緊抱住我, 幾乎到了無法呼吸的地步, 然後才放開我。 一兩個小時後,外婆看到我, 會問我:「Bryan,你 仍然感受得到我的擁抱嗎?」 如果我回答「沒有」,她會再次進攻, 如果我說「有」,她就不再打擾我。 她有一種 讓人想親近她的特質。 唯一的困擾是她有十個小孩, 我媽媽是當中最年幼的。 有時候我想要花時間和她相處, 很難得她的時間和注意力。 我的表兄弟姊妹們總是在圍繞在四周。
And I remember, when I was about eight or nine years old, waking up one morning, going into the living room, and all of my cousins were running around. And my grandmother was sitting across the room, staring at me. And at first, I thought we were playing a game. And I would look at her, and I'd smile, but she was very serious. And after about 15 or 20 minutes of this, she got up and she came across the room, and she took me by the hand, and she said, "Come on, Bryan. You and I are going to have a talk." And I remember this just like it happened yesterday. I never will forget it.
我記得,當我大概八或九歲的時候, 有天早上醒來,走進客廳, 我所有的表兄弟姊妹都在。 我外婆坐在客廳的另外一邊 盯著我看。 一開始我以為我們在玩遊戲。 我笑著回看她, 但她非常嚴肅。 大約15或20分鐘之後, 她起身走過客廳, 牽起我的手, 她說:「來吧,Bryan。 我們需要談一下。」 這彷彿是昨天才發生過的事。 我永遠不會忘記。
She took me out back and said, "Bryan, I'm going to tell you something, but you don't tell anybody what I tell you." I said, "OK, Mama." She said, "Now, you make sure you don't do that." I said, "Sure." Then she sat me down and she looked at me, and she said, "I want you to know I've been watching you." And she said, "I think you're special." She said, "I think you can do anything you want to do." I will never forget it.
她帶我到外面,跟我說: 「Bryan,我要跟你說一些事, 但你不可以跟任何人說。」 我說,「好的,嬤嬤。」 她說:「你保證你不跟別人說。」 我說:「當然。」 然後她要我坐下,看著我, 她說:「我要你知道, 我一直都在注意你。」 「我覺得你很特別。」 「我認為你可以做到任何你想要做的事。」 我永遠忘不了這一幕。
And then she said, "I just need you to promise me three things, Bryan." I said, "OK, Mama." She said, "The first thing I want you to promise me is that you'll always love your mom." She said, "That's my baby girl, and you have to promise me now you'll always take care of her." Well, I adored my mom, so I said, "Yes, Mama. I'll do that." Then she said, "The second thing I want you to promise me is that you'll always do the right thing, even when the right thing is the hard thing." And I thought about it, and I said, "Yes, Mama. I'll do that." Then finally, she said, "The third thing I want you to promise me is that you'll never drink alcohol."
接著她說:「我要你 答應我三件事情,Bryan。」 我說:「沒問題,嬤嬤。」 她說:「第一,我要你答應我 你會永遠愛你的母親。」 她說:「她是我的寶貝女兒, 你要答應我,你會永遠照顧她。」 我非常愛我媽媽,於是我說:「好的,嬤嬤。」 接著她說:「第二,我要你答應我, 你永遠都要做正確的事, 即使有時候,正確的事是相對困難的事。」 我想了一下,回答:「好的,嬤嬤。我會照做。」 最後她說:「第三件事,我要你保證, 你永遠不喝酒。」
(Laughter)
(笑聲)
Well, I was nine years old, so I said, "Yes, Mama. I'll do that."
我當時才九歲,所以我說:「好的,嬤嬤。我答應妳。」
I grew up in the country in the rural South, and I have a brother a year older than me and a sister a year younger. When I was about 14 or 15, one day, my brother came home and he had this six-pack of beer; I don't know where he got it. He grabbed me and my sister, and we went out in the woods, and we were just out there doing the stuff we crazily did, and he had a sip of this beer and gave some to my sister and she had some, and they offered it to me. I said, "No, that's OK. Y'all go ahead. I'm not going to have any." My brother said, "Come on. We're doing this today; you always do what we do. I had some, your sister had some. Have some beer." I said, "No, I don't feel right about that. Y'all go ahead." And then my brother stared at me and said, "What's wrong with you? Have some beer." Then he looked at me real hard and said, "Oh, I hope you're not still hung up on that conversation Mama had with you."
我在南方的鄉村中長大, 我有一個大一歲的哥哥和一個小一歲的妹妹。 當我大概14或15歲的時候, 有一天我哥哥帶了半打啤酒回家, 我不知道他從哪裡弄來的。 然後,他帶著我和我妹妹到樹林中, 我們在那裡瘋狂玩樂嬉鬧, 我哥哥喝了一口啤酒,接著交給我妹妹,她跟著喝了一些, 然後他們將酒遞給我。 我說:「不用了,你們喝就好,我不喝啤酒。」 我哥哥說:「試試看,今天我們就是要一起嘗試這件事, 我喝了,妹妹也喝了,你也喝一些吧。」 我說:「不要,我覺得這樣不好。你們喝吧。」 我哥哥盯著我看, 他說:「你哪根筋不對勁?喝點啤酒吧。」 接著他懷疑地看著我,他說, 「噢,我希望你不是還在 為了嬤嬤跟你說的話煩惱。」 (笑聲)
(Laughter)
我說:「你在說什麼?」
I said, "What are you talking about?" He said, "Oh, Mama tells all the grandkids that they're special."
哥哥說:「喔,嬤嬤告訴所有孫子他們很特別。」 (笑聲)
(Laughter)
我當時心碎了。
I was devastated.
(笑聲)
(Laughter)
但我要跟你們承認一件事。
And I'm going to admit something to you. I'm going to tell you something I probably shouldn't. I know this might be broadcast broadly. But I'm 52 years old, and I'm going to admit to you that I've never had a drop of alcohol.
這件事我也許不該說出來。 我知道這個演說是會散播出去的。 我現在52歲了, 而且我要承認 我從來沒有沾過一滴酒精。 (掌聲)
(Applause)
我說這個不是因為我認為這是有品德的事;
I don't say that because I think that's virtuous; I say that because there is power in identity. When we create the right kind of identity, we can say things to the world around us that they don't actually believe make sense. We can get them to do things that they don't think they can do. When I thought about my grandmother, of course she would think all her grandkids were special. My grandfather was in prison during prohibition. My male uncles died of alcohol-related diseases. And these were the things she thought we needed to commit to.
我說這個是因為自我定位是有力量的。 當有了正確的自我定位, 我們可以讓周遭的人 更輕易被說服。 我們能激勵他們做些 他們不認為自己可以做的事。 當我想到我的外婆, 她當然會認為她所有的孫子都很特別。 在美國的禁酒時期,我外公被關在監獄裡。 我的幾個舅舅死於酒精相關的疾病。 所以這是外婆要我們承諾她的理由。
Well, I've been trying to say something about our criminal justice system. This country is very different today than it was 40 years ago. In 1972, there were 300,000 people in jails and prisons. Today, there are 2.3 million. The United States now has the highest rate of incarceration in the world. We have seven million people on probation and parole. And mass incarceration, in my judgment, has fundamentally changed our world. In poor communities, in communities of color, there is this despair, there is this hopelessness that is being shaped by these outcomes. One out of three Black men between the ages of 18 and 30 is in jail, in prison, on probation or parole. In urban communities across this country -- Los Angeles, Philadelphia, Baltimore, Washington -- 50 to 60 percent of all young men of color are in jail or prison or on probation or parole.
我開始來聊一些, 關於美國的犯罪司法系統。 我們的國家和40年前相比 有非常大的不同。 在1972年,有三十萬人 被關在拘留所或監獄中。 現在,人數已經高達兩百三十萬人。 美國有全世界最高比例的 服刑人口。 我們有七百萬人在緩刑和假釋中。 我認為,大量的判刑, 徹底改變了我們的世界。 在貧困的社區裡,有色人種的社區裡, 充滿了絕望。 對未來不抱希望。 這就是現今制度產生的一些後果。 18歲到30歲的黑人男子, 有三分之一 在拘留所、監獄裡,緩刑或假釋中。 美國的大城市 洛杉磯,賓州,巴爾地摩,華盛頓 百分之五十到六十的年輕有色人種 在拘留所、監獄裡,緩刑或假釋中。 我國的法制系統
Our system isn't just being shaped in these ways that seem to be distorting around race, they're also distorted by poverty. We have a system of justice in this country that treats you much better if you're rich and guilty than if you're poor and innocent. Wealth, not culpability, shapes outcomes. And yet, we seem to be very comfortable. The politics of fear and anger have made us believe that these are problems that are not our problems. We've been disconnected.
不僅是被種族問題扭曲了, 似乎也被貧窮所扭曲了。 在這個國家,我們的司法系統 對待富有的犯罪者 比貧窮但清白的人還好。 財富決定結果, 而不是有罪與否。 然而,一般民眾似乎還蠻習慣的。 恐懼和憤怒的政治操作 讓我們相信 這些問題不是我們的問題。 我們已經脫節了。
It's interesting to me. We're looking at some very interesting developments in our work. My state of Alabama, like a number of states, actually permanently disenfranchises you if you have a criminal conviction. Right now in Alabama, 34 percent of the Black male population has permanently lost the right to vote. We're actually projecting that in another 10 years, the level of disenfranchisement will be as high as it's been since prior to the passage of the Voting Rights Act. And there is this stunning silence.
引起我注意的是, 我在工作中看到些非常有趣的發展。 我所居住的阿拉巴馬州,如同很多其它州一般, 如果你曾經犯罪過, 你的公民權利會被永遠剝奪。 現在在阿拉巴馬州, 百分之三十四的黑人男性人口數 已經永遠失去投票權。 我們推斷,再過十年後, 被剝奪公民權的人數比例 將和通過選舉權法之前 不分上下。 這事實令人震驚。
I represent children. A lot of my clients are very young. The United States is the only country in the world where we sentence 13-year-old children to die in prison. We have life imprisonment without parole for kids in this country. And we're actually doing some litigation. The only country in the world.
我很多客戶都非常年輕, 有時我會成為一些孩子的委任律師。 美國是世界上唯一一個國家 會將13歲的小孩 判死刑。 這也是世界上唯一一個國家 會判小孩終身監禁,不得保釋。 實際上,我們仍然在為這些案子奮鬥,進行訴訟。
I represent people on death row. It's interesting, this question of the death penalty. In many ways, we've been taught to think that the real question is: Do people deserve to die for the crimes they've committed? And that's a very sensible question. But there's another way of thinking about where we are in our identity. The other way of thinking about it is not: Do people deserve to die for the crimes they commit?, but: Do we deserve to kill? I mean, it's fascinating.
我也會為死刑犯辯護。 死刑這個問題很有趣。 在很多方面,我們被引導朝向 人們是否應該為他們所犯的罪而死? 這個問題去思考。 這是個非常合理的問題。 但有另外一種思考的方式, 這有關我們本身的定位。 另一種思考的方式, 不是人們是否應該為他們所犯的罪而死, 而是我們是否有權利去結束別人的生命? 我的意思是,這很值得玩味。
Death penalty in America is defined by error. For every nine people who have been executed, we've actually identified one innocent person who's been exonerated and released from death row. A kind of astonishing error rate -- one out of nine people, innocent. I mean, it's fascinating. In aviation, we would never let people fly on airplanes if, for every nine planes that took off, one would crash.
在美國,死刑會被錯判。 每九個被判死刑的人之中, 就有一個是無辜的, 事後會被證明無罪,然後釋放。 多人震驚的失誤率, 九個死刑犯中,就有一個是清白的。 這真的難以置信。 以飛行來比喻,如果每九架起飛的飛機中, 就有一架會墜機, 我們絕對不會讓人們開飛機。
(Laughter)
但不知道為什麼,我們卻無視這個問題。
But somehow, we can insulate ourselves from this problem. It's not our problem. It's not our burden. It's not our struggle.
這不是我們自身的問題。 這不是我們自身的責任。 這不是我們該努力爭取的。
I talk a lot about these issues. I talk about race and this question of whether we deserve to kill. And it's interesting, when I teach my students about African American history, I tell them about slavery. I tell them about terrorism, the era that began at the end of reconstruction that went on to World War II. We don't really know very much about it. But for African Americans in this country, that was an era defined by terror. In many communities, people had to worry about being lynched. They had to worry about being bombed. It was the threat of terror that shaped their lives. And these older people come up to me now and say, "Mr. Stevenson, you give talks, you make speeches, you tell people to stop saying we're dealing with terrorism for the first time in our nation's history after 9/11." They tell me to say, "No, tell them that we grew up with that." And that era of terrorism, of course, was followed by segregation and decades of racial subordination and apartheid.
我談過很多相關的議題。 我講到種族, 還有我們是否有權利結束別人的生命這個問題。 有趣的是,當我教我的學生非裔美國人的歷史時, 我告訴他們有關奴隸制度, 有關恐怖主義, 開始於南北戰爭結束後, 接著第二次世界大戰爆發。 其實我們不是真的非常了解這些。 但對這個國家中的非裔美國人, 那是個充滿恐懼的年代。 在很多社區,人們擔心被處私刑, 擔心被武器攻擊。 這種恐怖威脅就一直存在是他們的生活。 現在這些老年人見到我, 他們說:「Steven先生,你四處演講, 你告訴人們, 不要再說在美國歷史中,九一一是我們第一次 遭遇恐怖攻擊。」 他們說:「告訴聽眾,我們從小就在恐怖威脅中長大。」 當然,這種恐怖行動, 造成了種族間的鴻溝, 於是有了長達幾十年的種族歧視, 和種族隔離政策。
And yet, we have in this country this dynamic where we really don't like to talk about our problems. We don't like to talk about our history. And because of that, we really haven't understood what it's meant to do the things we've done historically. We're constantly running into each other. We're constantly creating tensions and conflicts. We have a hard time talking about race, and I believe it's because we are unwilling to commit ourselves to a process of truth and reconciliation. In South Africa, people understood that we couldn't overcome apartheid without a commitment to truth and reconciliation. In Rwanda, even after the genocide, there was this commitment. But in this country, we haven't done that.
然而,在這個國家裡, 我們有個默契,不討論我們的問題; 我們不談論我們的歷史。 正因如此,我們不真的理解 這些歷史事件的真正意義。 我們持續地互相產生衝突。 我們不停地製造緊張情況和鬥爭。 我們不能好好地談論種族, 因為我們不願意立下承諾 要面對事實和進行和解。 在南非,人們了解 沒有下定決心要了解事實和進行和解的話, 沒有辦法戰勝種族隔離政策。 在盧安達即使發生了大屠殺,事後也有這種彼此的和解和承諾。 但在美國,我們不曾這樣做過。
I was giving some lectures in Germany about the death penalty. It was fascinating, because one of the scholars stood up after the presentation and said, "Well, you know, it's deeply troubling to hear what you're talking about." He said, "We don't have the death penalty in Germany, and of course, we can never have the death penalty in Germany." And the room got very quiet, and this woman said, "There's no way, with our history, we could ever engage in the systematic killing of human beings. It would be unconscionable for us to, in an intentional and deliberate way, set about executing people." And I thought about that. What would it feel like to be living in a world where the nation-state of Germany was executing people, especially if they were disproportionately Jewish? I couldn't bear it. It would be unconscionable.
我在德國做過一些有關死刑的演講。 有趣的是, 演說結束後,有位學者站起來, 她說:「你的演講, 內容很令人痛心。」 她接著說:「在德國,我們沒有死刑。 我們也永遠不可能有死刑。」 然後整個房間變得非常安靜, 這位女士接著說: 「我們從歷史得到的教訓, 讓我們絕對不可能 有系統地殺人。 有目的且蓄意地 處決人類, 這是我們良心上所不允許的。」 我思考這個問題, 如果生活在 會執行死刑的德國, 特別是任意處死猶太人, 到底是怎樣的感覺。 這個想法令我覺得難受。 這是不合理的。
And yet, in this country, in the states of the Old South, we execute people -- where you're 11 times more likely to get the death penalty if the victim is white than if the victim is Black, 22 times more likely to get it if the defendant is Black and the victim is white -- in the very states where there are, buried in the ground, the bodies of people who were lynched. And yet, there is this disconnect.
然而,在這個國家, 在南方各州, 我們仍在執行死刑。 刑事案件中,當受害者是白人,被告被判死刑的機率 比受害者是黑人時,高了11倍。 如果被告正好是黑人,受害者是白人, 那被判死刑的機率高達22倍。 就在這些州裡, 土地裡埋著被受私刑而死的人們。 然而,我們置之不理。 我相信我們有自我定位危機。
Well, I believe that our identity is at risk, that when we actually don't care about these difficult things, the positive and wonderful things are nonetheless implicated. We love innovation. We love technology. We love creativity. We love entertainment. But ultimately, those realities are shadowed by suffering, abuse, degradation, marginalization. And for me, it becomes necessary to integrate the two, because ultimately, we are talking about a need to be more hopeful, more committed, more dedicated to the basic challenges of living in a complex world. And for me, that means spending time thinking and talking about the poor, the disadvantaged, those who will never get to TED, but thinking about them in a way that is integrated in our own lives.
當我們不在乎 這些艱難的事情時, 正面和美好的事物 也會受到牽連。 我們熱愛創新, 我們熱愛科技,我們熱愛創意。 我們熱愛娛樂。 但是到最後, 這些美好的現實 會因為苦難, 傷害,墮落,忽視 而蒙受陰影。 對我而言,同時面對美好和艱難的事, 是無法避免的。 畢竟到頭來我們關注的 是生活在複雜的世界,如何充滿希望, 堅定且專注的 處理所有遭遇的挑戰。 這代表要 花時間思考和談論 有關這些貧困,屈居劣勢, 永遠不可能參加TED演講的人們。 要將他們 納入我們生活思考中的一部分。
You know, ultimately, we all have to believe things we haven't seen. We do. As rational as we are, as committed to intellect as we are, innovation, creativity, development comes not from the ideas in our mind alone. They come from the ideas in our mind that are also fueled by some conviction in our heart. And it's that mind-heart connection that I believe compels us to not just be attentive to all the bright and dazzly things, but also the dark and difficult things. Václav Havel, the great Czech leader, talked about this. He said, "When we were in Eastern Europe and dealing with oppression, we wanted all kinds of things. But mostly what we needed was hope, an orientation of the spirit, a willingness to sometimes be in hopeless places and be a witness."
基於我們具有的理性和智慧, 我們終究必須相信這些我們不曾見到的事。 發明、創造力和發展進化的能力 不單單只是靠 人類腦中的智力空想而來。 在腦中形成的想法, 其實會受到心裡的信念 刺激而產生。 我相信就是這腦力和信念的結合, 會迫使我們 不只是注意 光明璀璨的事情, 也關心這些黑暗且困難的事情。 Vaclav Havel,捷克的偉大領導者,也如此說過。 他說:「當我們在東歐面對壓迫時, 我們祈求各種東西, 但我們最需要的是希望, 一種精神的方針, 讓我們願意處於絕望的地方, 當一位目擊者。」
Well, that orientation of the spirit is very much at the core of what I believe even TED communities have to be engaged in. There is no disconnect around technology and design that will allow us to be fully human until we pay attention to suffering, to poverty, to exclusion, to unfairness, to injustice. Now, I will warn you that this kind of identity is a much more challenging identity than ones that don't pay attention to this. It will get to you.
這精神方針 就是我的信仰中心, 即使是TED社群們 都必須要參與。 只要我們能開始去關心這些苦難 貧困,排斥,不公平,不正義, 現代科技和嶄新的工藝設計, 也不會消磨我們的人性, 我們會成為更完整的人。 現在我要提醒你們的是, 開始有了這種自我定位的覺醒, 會比未曾意識到之前 更具挑戰性。 它會影響你。
I had the great privilege, when I was a young lawyer, of meeting Rosa Parks. And Ms. Parks used to come back to Montgomery every now and then, and she would get together with two of her dearest friends, these older women, Johnnie Carr, who was the organizer of the Montgomery bus boycott -- amazing African American woman -- and Virginia Durr, a white woman, whose husband, Clifford Durr, represented Dr. King. And these women would get together and just talk.
當我還是一個年輕律師時,我有幸認識Rosa Parks。 Parks女士有時會到蒙哥馬利, 和兩個好朋友聚會聊天, 這些年長的女人, 包括Johnnie Carr, 蒙哥馬利巴士抵制事件的發起人之一, 令人欽佩的非裔美國女士。 還有Virginia Durr,一位白人女士, 她的丈夫,Cliffor Durr,曾代表馬丁路德金恩博士。 這些女士會聚在一起聊天。
And every now and then Ms. Carr would call me, and she'd say, "Bryan, Ms. Parks is coming to town. We're going to get together and talk. Do you want to come over and listen?" And I'd say, "Yes, ma'am, I do." She'd say, "What are you going to do when you get here?" I said, "I'm going to listen." And I'd go over there and I would, I'd just listen. It would be so energizing and so empowering.
Carr女士有時會打電話給我, 她說:「Bryan,Parks女士要到鎮上來,我們要聚會。 你想要過來聽聽我們說些什麼嗎?」 我說:「好的,女士,我會去。」 她問:「那你來了要做什麼?」 我說:「我會靜靜地聽。」 當我加入聚會,我就是聆聽。 這樣的聚會總是讓我深受激勵,且充滿力量。
And one time I was over there listening to these women talk, and after a couple of hours, Ms. Parks turned to me and said, "Bryan, tell me what the Equal Justice Initiative is. Tell me what you're trying to do." And I began giving her my rap. "We're trying to challenge injustice. We're trying to help people who have been wrongly convicted. We're trying to confront bias and discrimination in the administration of criminal justice. We're trying to end life without parole sentences for children. We're trying to do something about the death penalty. We're trying to reduce the prison population. We're trying to end mass incarceration."
有一次當我在聽這些女士說話, 過了幾個小時候,Parks女士轉向我, 她說:「Bryan,司法正義精神是什麼, 告訴我你打算怎麼做。」 我開始我的饒舌演說。 我說:「我們試著挑戰不正義。 我們試著幫助被誤判的罪犯。 我們試著對抗刑法審判時的 偏見和歧視。 我們試著終結對小孩判終身不得假釋的審判。 我們試著處理死刑這個議題。 我們試著降低監獄人數。 結束大量判刑的情況。」 當我結束整段的說唱時,她看著我,
I gave her my whole rap, and when I finished she looked at me and she said, "Mmm mmm mmm. That's going to make you tired, tired, tired."
然後她說:「嗯嗯嗯。」 她說:「這會讓你很累,很累,很累。」 (笑聲)
(Laughter)
這個時候Carr女士傾身向前,指著我,
And that's when Ms. Carr leaned forward, she put her finger in my face, she said, "That's why you've got to be brave, brave, brave."
她說,「這就是為什麼你一定要勇敢,很勇敢,非常勇敢。」
And I actually believe that the TED community needs to be more courageous. We need to find ways to embrace these challenges, these problems, the suffering. Because ultimately, our humanity depends on everyone's humanity. I've learned very simple things doing the work that I do. It's just taught me very simple things. I've come to understand and to believe that each of us is more than the worst thing we've ever done. I believe that for every person on the planet. I think if somebody tells a lie, they're not just a liar. I think if somebody takes something that doesn't belong to them, they're not just a thief. I think even if you kill someone, you're not just a killer. And because of that, there's this basic human dignity that must be respected by law. I also believe that in many parts of this country, and certainly in many parts of this globe, that the opposite of poverty is not wealth. I don't believe that. I actually think, in too many places, the opposite of poverty is justice.
而我相信TED 也是一個勇敢社群。 我們必須找到方法 接受這些挑戰, 面對這些問題,苦難。 因為最終,我們的人道精神決定在 每個人的人道精神。 從我從事的工作中, 我學到了非常簡單的事情。 我了解且相信 我們每個人的價值 不單單取決於我們曾做過最壞的事。 我相信地球上每個人皆是如此。 如果有人說謊,不代表他就只是一個騙子。 如果有人拿了不屬於他們的東西, 不代表他們就只是小偷。 即使你殺了人,也不意味著你只是一個兇手。 就因如此,法律一定要尊重 基本的人類尊嚴。 我也相信 在這個國家的很多地方, 還有一定也在這個地球上很多地方, 貧窮的相反不是富有。 我不相信這個。 事實上,我覺得在太多地方, 貧窮的相反是正義。
And finally, I believe that, despite the fact that it is so dramatic and so beautiful and so inspiring and so stimulating, we will ultimately not be judged by our technology, we won't be judged by our design, we won't be judged by our intellect and reason. Ultimately, you judge the character of a society not by how they treat their rich and the powerful and the privileged, but by how they treat the poor, the condemned, the incarcerated. Because it's in that nexus that we actually begin to understand truly profound things about who we are.
最後,我相信 儘管我們的科技引人注目, 耀眼而激勵人心, 又這麼具有啟發性, 但評斷一個社會的品格, 不是依據科技發展, 不是依據我們的智商和理性。 也不是觀察他們對待富有、權貴人士的方式。 最終,評斷一個社會的品格, 而是看他們如何對待窮困, 被譴責,和被監禁的人的方式。 因為就是在這些關係裡, 我們才會開始了解我們自己是誰 這類深奧的事情。
I sometimes get out of balance. I'll end with this story. I sometimes push too hard. I do get tired, as we all do. Sometimes those ideas get ahead of our thinking in ways that are important. And I've been representing these kids who have been sentenced to these very harsh sentences. And I go to the jail and I see my client, who's 13 and 14, and he's been certified to stand trial as an adult. I start thinking, well, how did that happen? How can a judge turn you into something that you're not? And the judge has certified him as an adult, but I see this kid.
當然我有時候也會感到不平衡。我用一個故事來結尾。 我有時候操之過急。 我真的覺得勞累,每個人都會。 有時候思考的速度追不上腦中的想法, 結果是很嚴重的。 我一直在擔任這些 被判重刑的小孩的律師。 當我去看守所,我看到只有13或14歲的孩子, 被要求以大人身分出庭受審。 我開始在想,到底發生了什麼事? 一個法官怎麼可以把你變成 另一個不同的身分? 當法官證實他是個成人時,我看到個卻是個小孩。
And I was up too late one night and I started thinking, well, if the judge can turn you into something you're not, the judge must have magic power. Yeah, Bryan, the judge has some magic power. You should ask for some of that. And because I was up too late and wasn't thinking real straight, I started working on a motion. I had a client who was 14 years old, a young, poor Black kid. And I started working on this motion, and the head of the motion was: "Motion to try my poor, 14-year-old Black male client like a privileged, white, 75-year-old corporate executive."
有一天晚上,我很晚還沒睡,然後我開始在想, 天啊,如果法官可以把你變成另一個根本不是你的身分, 那麼法官一定有神奇的魔力。 好棒啊,Bryan,法官有神奇的魔力。 你應該要跟他討一些魔力的。 因為我太晚還沒睡,我其實在胡思亂想。 我開始起草一份議案。 我有一個14歲的客戶,一個年輕,貧困的黑人男孩。 我接著寫這份議案, 議案的主旨是:「請視我的被告, 窮困,14歲的黑人男孩子, 如同一位有特權的,75歲白人 企業經理。」
(Laughter)
(掌聲)
(Applause and cheers)
接著我在訴訟議案中寫到
And I put in my motion that there was prosecutorial misconduct and police misconduct and judicial misconduct. There was a crazy line in there about how there's no conduct in this county, it's all misconduct. And the next morning, I woke up and I thought, now, did I dream that crazy motion, or did I actually write it? And to my horror, not only had I written it, but I had sent it to court.
此案中檢察官,警察,法院都處置不當。 還說了這個州管理不當之類的瘋言瘋語, 總之就是從頭錯到尾。 隔天早上,我起床後開始在想,是我做夢夢到這個瘋狂的議案? 還是我真的寫了一份? 令我震驚的是,我不只寫了, 我還把它傳給法院了。 (掌聲)
(Applause)
幾個月過去,
A couple months went by, and I just had forgotten all about it. And I finally decided, "Gosh, I've got to go to the court and do this crazy case." And I got in my car, and I was feeling really overwhelmed -- overwhelmed. And I got in my car and went to this courthouse. And I was thinking, this is going to be so difficult, so painful. And I finally got out of the car and started walking up to the courthouse.
我完全忘記這件事, 然後我最後決定, 天啊,我必須去法院處理這瘋狂的案子。 於是我走進我的車, 當下我真的覺得非常不知所措。 前往法院途中, 我在想,這將會非常困難,非常痛苦。 當我下車,走向法院,
踏上法院的階梯時,
And as I was walking up the steps, there was an older Black man who was the janitor in this courthouse. When this man saw me, he came over and said, "Who are you?" I said, "I'm a lawyer." He said, "You're a lawyer?" I said, "Yes, sir." And this man came over to me, and he hugged me. And he whispered in my ear. He said, "I'm so proud of you." And I have to tell you, it was energizing. It connected deeply with something in me about identity, about the capacity of every person to contribute to community, to a perspective that is hopeful.
有一個年老的黑人法院清潔工。 當他看到我時,他走過來, 他說:「你是誰?」 我說:「我是律師。」他說:「你是律師?」我說:「是的,先生。」 然後這位男士靠近我, 給了我一個擁抱。 他在我耳邊低語。 他說:「我真為你感到驕傲。」 我必須跟你們說, 這讓我精神一振。 他觸動了我內心深處的 自我定位。 我相信每個人都有能力 可以貢獻人群,可以做有希望的事,
Well, I went into the courtroom. And as soon as I walked in, the judge saw me coming. He said, "Mr. Stevenson, did you write this crazy motion?" I said, "Yes, sir. I did." And we started arguing. And people started coming in, just outraged I'd written these crazy things. And police officers were coming in and assistant prosecutors and clerk workers. Before I knew it, the courtroom was filled with people angry that we were talking about race, that we were talking about poverty, talking about inequality.
於是我走進法庭。 當法官看到我, 他問:「Stevenson先生,是你寫了這份瘋狂的議案嗎?」 我說,「是的,先生,我寫的。」,然後我們開始爭論。 義憤填膺的群眾開始進入法庭, 我寫了這些瘋狂的東西。 警察進來了, 助理檢察官和辦事員也都進來。 在我注意到之前,法庭裡已經擠滿了憤怒的群眾。 因為我們談論種族, 談論貧窮, 談論不平等的問題。
And out of the corner of my eye, I could see this janitor pacing back and forth. He kept looking through the window and could hear all the holler. And finally, this older Black man with a very worried look on his face came into the courtroom and sat behind me, almost at counsel table. Ten minutes later, the judge said we'd take a break. During the break, there was a deputy sheriff who was offended that the janitor had come into court. The deputy jumped up and ran over to this older Black man. He said, "Jimmy, what are you doing in this courtroom?" And this older Black man stood up and looked at that deputy and he looked at me, and he said, "I came into this courtroom to tell this young man, 'Keep your eyes on the prize, hold on.'"
我用眼角餘光看見清潔工來回踱步。 他一直透過窗戶看進來,他可聽到這些叫喊聲。 他不停地來回踱步。 最後,這位年老的黑人臉上掛著擔心的表情 走進法庭且坐在我後面, 幾乎碰到律師桌。 大概十分鐘後,法官宣佈休息。 休息時,有位副警長 因為清潔工進到法庭中 發起脾氣。 他跳起來跑向這位年長的黑人。 他說:「Jimmy,你在法庭裡做什麼?」 這位年長黑人站起身, 他看著警長也看著我, 他說:「我進到法庭來, 為了告訴這位年輕男士, 專注在你的目標,堅持下去。」
I've come to TED because I believe that many of you understand that the moral arc of the universe is long, but it bends toward justice; that we cannot be full, evolved human beings until we care about human rights and basic dignity; that all of our survival is tied to the survival of everyone; that our visions of technology and design and entertainment and creativity have to be married with visions of humanity, compassion and justice. And more than anything, for those of you who share that, I've simply come to tell you to keep your eyes on the prize, hold on.
我來到TED, 因為我相信你們當中很多人了解 宇宙的道德弧形很長, 但它是朝向正義彎曲的。 如果我們不在乎人權和生命基本尊嚴, 我們就無法完全進化。 全人類的生存 和每一個人的生存緊緊相扣。 我們對科技和工藝設計, 娛樂和創意的看法, 都必須結合對人性、憐憫 和正義的看法。 最重要的是, 對你們當中也抱持同樣看法的人, 我來的目的是要告訴你們, 專注在你的目標,堅持下去。
Thank you very much.
非常謝謝你們。
(Applause and cheers)
(掌聲)
Chris Anderson: Brian, so you heard and saw an obvious desire by this audience, this community, to help you on your way and to do something on this issue. Other than writing a check, what could we do?
Chris Anderson:你可以聽到也看到 這些觀眾,這個社群,顯然很希望能 在這個議題上和你站在一起。 除了開張支票之外, 我們還可以做什麼?
BS: Well, there are opportunities all around us. If you live in the state of California, for example, there's a referendum coming up this spring where there's going to be an effort to redirect some of the money we spend on the politics of punishment. For example, here in California, we're going to spend one billion dollars on the death penalty in the next five years -- one billion dollars. And yet, 46 percent of all homicide cases don't result in arrest, 56 percent of all rape cases don't result. So there's an opportunity to change that. And this referendum would propose having those dollars go to law enforcement and safety. And I think that opportunity exists all around us.
我們周遭有很多機會。 舉例來說,如果你住在加州, 這個春天即將有一個公投 決定是否要重新分配一些 我們原本花費在刑罰操作的經費。 例如,在加州, 未來五年內, 我們將花十億美元在死刑上 十億美元。 然而,百分之四十六的殺人案件 並沒有逮捕到犯人。 百分之五十六的強暴案沒有破案。 所以是有機會可以改變的。 這個公投提議將這些金錢 投入落實法律和安全。 我想機會存在我們周遭。
CA: There's been this huge decline in crime in America over the last three decades. And part of the narrative of that is sometimes that it's about increased incarceration rates. What would you say to someone who believed that?
在過去的三十年來, 美國的犯罪率有顯著的下降。 有部分的看法是 這跟提高的監禁率有關。 你會怎麼跟持有這種看法的人解釋?
BS: Well, actually, the violent crime rate has remained relatively stable. The great increase in mass incarceration in this country wasn't really in violent crime categories. It was this misguided war on drugs. That's where the dramatic increases have come in our prison population.
事實上美國暴力犯罪的數字 一直沒有多大變動。 大量增加的服刑人口, 並不是來自暴力犯罪, 而是毒品犯罪。 那是我們的監獄人口 劇增的原因。
(Applause)
我們被花俏的判刑名詞沖昏了頭,
And we got carried away with the rhetoric of punishment. And so we have "Three Strikes" laws that put people in prison forever for stealing a bicycle, for low-level property crimes, rather than making them give those resources back to the people who they victimized. I believe we need to do more to help people who are victimized by crime, not do less. And I think our current punishment philosophy does nothing for no one. And I think that's the orientation that we have to change.
例如我們用三振出局法嚴懲慣犯 將偷腳踏車或廉價物品 的罪犯判終身監禁, 而不是讓他們 去彌補受害者。 我相信我們需要做的是給予犯罪受害人更多幫助, 不是只著重在嚴懲罪犯。 我們現有的刑罰思考哲學 對任何人都沒有好處。 所以我認為這個大方向需要改變。 (掌聲)
(Applause)
Bryan,你的演說動人心弦。
CA: Bryan, you've struck a massive chord here. You're an inspiring person. Thank you so much for coming to TED. Thank you.
你是個能激發人心的人。 非常謝謝你來到TED。謝謝。 (掌聲)
(Applause and cheers)
BS: Thank you. Thank you. (Applause and cheers)