Phyllis Rodriguez: We are here today because of the fact that we have what most people consider an unusual friendship. And it is. And yet, it feels natural to us now.
Phyllis Rodriguez: Ovdje smo danas zbog činjenice što imamo, prema mišljenju mnogih, neobično prijateljstvo. I to je istina. A ipak, to nam se čini prirodnim.
I first learned that my son had been in the World Trade Center on the morning of September 11th, 2001. We didn't know if he had perished yet until 36 hours later. At the time, we knew that it was political. We were afraid of what our country was going to do in the name of our son -- my husband, Orlando, and I and our family. And when I saw it -- and yet, through the shock, the terrible shock, and the terrible explosion in our lives, literally, we were not vengeful. And a couple of weeks later when Zacarias Moussaoui was indicted on six counts of conspiracy to commit terrorism, and the U.S. government called for a death penalty for him, if convicted, my husband and I spoke out in opposition to that, publicly. Through that and through human rights groups, we were brought together with several other victims' families.
Prvo sam saznala kako je moj sin bio u Svjetskom trgovinskom centru ujutro 11-og rujna 2001. godine. Nismo znali je li poginuo unutar prvih 36 sati. Tada smo znali kako je to vezano uz politiku. Bojali smo se što će naša zemlja učiniti u ime našeg sina -- moj muž, Orlando, i ja i naša obitelj. A kada sam vidjela -- a ipak, kroz šok, strašan šok, i strašnu eksploziju u našim životima, doslovno, nismo bili osvetoljubivi. I par tjedana kasnije kada je Zacharias Moussaoui bio optužen po šest točaka urote terorizmom, i američka vlada je pozvala na smrtnu kaznu za njega, ako bude osuđen, moj muž i ja smo progovorili u javnosti protiv toga. Kroz to i preko udruga za ljudska prava, spojili smo se s nekoliko drugih obitelji žrtava.
When I saw Aicha in the media, coming over when her son was indicted, and I thought, "What a brave woman. Someday I want to meet that woman when I'm stronger." I was still in deep grief; I knew I didn't have the strength. I knew I would find her someday, or we would find each other. Because, when people heard that my son was a victim, I got immediate sympathy. But when people learned what her son was accused of, she didn't get that sympathy. But her suffering is equal to mine.
Kada sam vidjela Aichu u medijima, kako dolazi ovdje kada je njezin sin bio optužen, pomislila sam, "Koja hrabra žena. Jednog dana kada budem snažnija, želim upoznati tu ženu." Još uvijek sam bila u stanju dubokog žalovanja; Znala sam kako nemam snage. Znala sam da ću je jednog dana pronaći, ili ćemo pronaći jedna drugu. Jer, kada ljudi čuju kako je moj sin bio žrtva, odmah dobijem saučešće. Ali kada ljudi saznaju za što je njezin sin bio optužen, ona ne dobije tu vrstu naklonosti. Ali njezina patnja je jednaka mojoj.
So we met in November 2002, and Aicha will now tell you how that came about.
Tako smo se upoznali u studenom 2002. godine. A Aicha će vam ispričati kako je došlo do toga.
(Translator) Aicha el-Wafi: Good afternoon, ladies and gentlemen. I am the mother of Zacarias Moussaoui. And I asked the Organization of Human Rights to put me in touch with the parents of the victims. So they introduced me to five families. And I saw Phyllis, and I watched her. She was the only mother in the group. The others were brothers, sisters. And I saw in her eyes that she was a mother, just like me. I suffered a lot as a mother. I was married when I was 14. I lost a child when I was 15, a second child when I was 16. So the story with Zacarias was too much really. And I still suffer, because my son is like he's buried alive. I know she really cried for her son. But she knows where he is. My son, I don't know where he is. I don't know if he's alive. I don't know if he's tortured. I don't know what happened to him.
(Prevoditeljica) Aicha el-Wafi: Dobar dan, dame i gospodo. Ja sam majka Zachariasa Moussaoui-a. I zamolila sam Organizaciju za ljudska prava da me spoji s roditeljima žrtava. Stoga su me oni upoznali s pet obitelji. I vidjela sam Phyllis, i gledala sam je. Ona je bila jedina majka u grupi. Ostali su bili braća, sestre. I vidjela sam u njezinim očima kako je ona bila majka, poput mene. Puno sam patila kao majka. Udala sam se s 14. Izgubila sam dijete s 15, drugo dijete kada mi je bilo 16. Stoga je priča sa Zacharias-om bila uistinu previše. I još uvijek patim, jer moj sin kao da je živ zakopan. Znam kako je doista oplakivala svog sina. Ali ona zna gdje je on. Moj sin, ne znam gdje je. Ne znam je li živ. Ne znam je li mučen. Ne znam što se dogodilo s njim.
So that's why I decided to tell my story, so that my suffering is something positive for other women. For all the women, all the mothers that give life, you can give back, you can change. It's up to us women, because we are women, because we love our children. We must be hand-in-hand and do something together. It's not against women, it's for us, for us women, for our children. I talk against violence, against terrorism. I go to schools to talk to young, Muslim girls so they don't accept to be married against their will very young. So if I can save one of the young girls, and avoid that they get married and suffer as much as I did, well this is something good. This is why I'm here in front of you.
Zato sam odlučila ispričati svoju priču, kako bi moja patnja predstavljala nešto pozitivno za druge žene. Za sve žene, sve majke koje daju život, možete to uzeti natrag, možete to promijeniti. To je na nama ženama, jer mi smo žene, jer mi volimo svoju djecu. Moramo biti složne i učiniti nešto zajedno. To nije protiv nas žena, to je za nas, za nas žene, za našu djecu. Ja govorim protiv nasilja, protiv terorizma. Odlazim u škole kako bi pričala mladim, muslimanskim curama da se ne udaju protiv svoje volje kada su još jako mlade. Zato, ako mogu spasiti jednu od tih mladih djevojki, i spriječiti da se udaju i pate toliko koliko sam ja patila, to je onda nešto dobro. Zbog toga sam ovdje pred vama.
PR: I would like to say that I have learned so much from Aicha, starting with that day we had our very first meeting with other family members -- which was a very private meeting with security, because it was November 2002, and, frankly, we were afraid of the super-patriotism of that time in the country -- those of us family members. But we were all so nervous. "Why does she want to meet us?" And then she was nervous. "Why did we want to meet her?" What did we want from each other? Before we knew each others' names, or anything, we had embraced and wept. Then we sat in a circle with support, with help, from people experienced in this kind of reconciliation. And Aicha started, and she said, "I don't know if my son is guilty or innocent, but I want to tell you how sorry I am for what happened to your families. I know what it is to suffer, and I feel that if there is a crime, a person should be tried fairly and punished." But she reached out to us in that way, and it was, I'd like to say, it was an ice-breaker. And what happened then is we all told our stories, and we all connected as human beings. By the end of the afternoon -- it was about three hours after lunch -- we'd felt as if we'd known each other forever.
PR: Htjela bih reći kako sam naučila toliko mnogo od Aicha-e, počevši već onog dana kada smo imale naš prvi sastanak s ostalim članovima obitelji -- koji je bio veoma privatni sastanak s osiguranjem, jer je bio studeni 2002., i, iskreno, bojali smo se super-patriotizma naše zemlje u to vrijeme -- mi, članovi obitelji. Ali svi smo bili tako nervozni. "Zašto nas ona želi upoznati?" A zatim je ona bila nervozna. "Zašto smo mi nju htjeli upoznati?" Što smo htjeli jedni od drugih? Prije nego smo saznali imena, ili bilo što, zagrlile smo se i plakale. Zatim smo sjeli u krug s potporom, s pomoći, od ljudi koji imaju iskustva s takvom vrstom pomirbe. I Aicha je započela, i rekla je, "Ne znam je li moj sin kriv ili nevin, ali želim vam reći koliko mi je žao za to što se dogodilo vašim obiteljima. Znam što je to patnja, i osjećam da, ukoliko dođe do zločina, osobu treba suditi pošteno i ta osoba treba biti kažnjena." Ali ona nam je pristupila na taj način. I to je bio, rekla bih, dobar način razbijanja nervoze. I ono što se dogodilo jest da smo svi mi ispričali svoje priče, i svi smo se povezali kao ljudska bića. Do kraja poslijepodneva -- bilo je to oko tri sata nakon ručka -- osjećali smo se kao da se znamo oduvijek.
Now what I learned from her, is a woman, not only who could be so generous under these present circumstances and what it was then, and what was being done to her son, but the life she's had. I never had met someone with such a hard life, from such a totally different culture and environment from my own. And I feel that we have a special connection, which I value very much. And I think it's all about being afraid of the other, but making that step and then realizing, "Hey, this wasn't so hard. Who else can I meet that I don't know, or that I'm so different from?"
Ono što sam naučila od nje, je žena, ne samo koja može biti toliko velikodušna pod tim sadašnjim okolnostima i ono što je bilo tada, i što se činilo njezinom sinu, već život koji je imala. Nikada nisam upoznala nekoga tko je imao tako težak život, a tko je bio iz potpuno drugačije kulture i okoline nego što je moja. I osjećam kako imamo posebnu vezu, koju cjenima jako puno. I mislim kako se radi o tome što smo se bojale jedna druge, no učinile smo taj korak i zatim shvatile, "Hej, pa to nije bilo tako teško. Koga još mogu sresti a da ga ne poznajem, ili od koga sam različita?"
So, Aicha, do you have a couple of words for conclusion? Because our time is up.
Dakle, Aicha, imaš li par riječi za zaključak? Jer naše vrijeme je isteklo.
(Laughter)
(Smijeh)
(Translator) AW: I wanted to say that we have to try to know other people, the other. You have to be generous, and your hearts must be generous, your mind must be generous. You must be tolerant. You have to fight against violence. And I hope that someday we'll all live together in peace and respecting each other. This is what I wanted to say.
(Prevoditeljica) AW: Željela sam reći kako moramo pokušavati upoznavati druge ljude. Morate biti velikodušni, i vaša srca moraju biti velikodušna, vaš um mora biti velikodušan. Morate biti tolerantni. Morate se boriti protiv nasilja. I nadam se kako ćemo jednog dana svi živjeti zajedno u miru i poštivati jedni druge. To sam željela reći.
(Applause)
(Pljesak)